[Subsea7]

Outra opção era as 4 Nansen. com upgrade ASW e assinar já 3 F-110, do mesmo fabricante....Opções não faltam.

[Drecas]

Um pouco offtopic, mas gostava que não se vendesse a VdG

É o primeiro navio da armada com qualquer sistema míssil, é um navio que significa uma grande transição da Marinha no pós 75, ainda que com vários anos de atraso

Converter a VdG a um navio museu acho que seria um bom e digno final para o navio e para a sua classe

[JohnM]

Outra opção era as 4 Nansen. com upgrade ASW e assinar já 3 F-110, do mesmo fabricante....Opções não faltam.

Concordo, nem que fosse 4+2…

[JohnM]

Um pouco offtopic, mas gostava que não se vendesse a VdG

É o primeiro navio da armada com qualquer sistema míssil, é um navio que significa uma grande transição da Marinha no pós 75, ainda que com vários anos de atraso

Converter a VdG a um navio museu acho que seria um bom e digno final para o navio e para a sua classe

100% de acordo

[MMaria]

Também pensei na Argentina como cliente ideal , visto já operarem as 360

Mas o mais certo era os nossos donos sul americanos oporem-se ao negócio

Nada de se opor, estão de bom tamanho para os primos argentos.

[LM]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

[JohnM]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Pesadelo logístico… diferentes mísseis, sensores e sistemas de combate à controlo de danos… ideia terrível…

[Cabeça de Martelo]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Penso que a última das Fragatas da classe tem 8x2 MK41 e não apenas um. O mais prático seria adquirir e colocar o segundo módulo MK41. A questão é que são apenas 4 Fragatas e as mesmas só estarão no mercado daqui a anos 5 anos quando começarem a receber as Type 26.

[P44]

Vender as 2 KD ao Chile não implicaria ficarmos sem fragatas ou com apenas 1 (Meko) durante uns bons anos? 😕😐🤐

[LM]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Pesadelo logístico… diferentes mísseis, sensores e sistemas de combate à controlo de danos… ideia terrível…

Temia isso; esperava que houvesse vantagem em "mix" de sensores diferentes - ie em uso operacional em conjunto - e a possibilidade de usar a FREMM para defesa aérea de maior alcance (com os Aster 30) e a(s) Nansen na defesa "ponto" (com ESSM 2).

[Cabeça de Martelo]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Pesadelo logístico… diferentes mísseis, sensores e sistemas de combate à controlo de danos… ideia terrível…

Temia isso; esperava que houvesse vantagem em "mix" de sensores diferentes - ie em uso operacional em conjunto - e a possibilidade de usar a FREMM para defesa aérea de maior alcance (com os Aster 30) e a(s) Nansen na defesa "ponto" (com ESSM 2).

Nansem modernizadas e F110 série 2? São do mesmo fabricante e devem ter muita coisa em comum após a modernização.

[JohnM]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Pesadelo logístico… diferentes mísseis, sensores e sistemas de combate à controlo de danos… ideia terrível…

Temia isso; esperava que houvesse vantagem em "mix" de sensores diferentes - ie em uso operacional em conjunto - e a possibilidade de usar a FREMM para defesa aérea de maior alcance (com os Aster 30) e a(s) Nansen na defesa "ponto" (com ESSM 2).

Nansem modernizadas e F110 série 2? São do mesmo fabricante e devem ter muita coisa em comum após a modernização.

É exatamente essa a minha opção preferida neste momento (fora o sonho molhado das T26, como é óbvio), seguida de 6 AH140 nas duas versões. As Nansen modernizadas podem inclusivamente levar o mesmo sistema de combate SCOMBA, provavelmente numa versão Lite…

[Ghidra]

As Nansen (com MLU e + "8-cell Mk 41 VLS") e as 2x  FREMM "ASW enhanced" dos italianos... completam-se bem ou é um "pesadelo logístico" a acontecer?

Pesadelo logístico… diferentes mísseis, sensores e sistemas de combate à controlo de danos… ideia terrível…

Temia isso; esperava que houvesse vantagem em "mix" de sensores diferentes - ie em uso operacional em conjunto - e a possibilidade de usar a FREMM para defesa aérea de maior alcance (com os Aster 30) e a(s) Nansen na defesa "ponto" (com ESSM 2).

Nansem modernizadas e F110 série 2? São do mesmo fabricante e devem ter muita coisa em comum após a modernização.

Para mim a melhor opção.  Ainda se podia junto da navantia negociar um pacote f110 + MLU

[Duarte]

Nansem modernizadas e F110 série 2? São do mesmo fabricante e devem ter muita coisa em comum após a modernização.

Comparison — these two frigate families are actually close cousins (Navantia is involved in both) but are designed with different emphases and generations of tech. Below I’ll lay out the main weapons / sensors / systems / mission kit side-by-side, then summarise what’s common and what’s different and give a short “how much is common” verdict.

Quick specs (headline)

Fridtjof Nansen class (Norway) — ~5,200–5,300 t full load, ~134 m. Built by Navantia (Bazan) to a design derived from the Álvaro de Bazán family; optimized for ASW with strong AAW self-defence.
Wikipedia
+1

F110 / “Bonifaz” class (Spain) — ~6,100 t, ~145 m. New Navantia design, strong emphasis on anti-submarine warfare + area AAW interoperability, modern integrated mast, SCOMBA combat system and high automation / digital-twin features. First hull launched Sept 2025; fitting-out/delivery later.
Naval News
+1

Weapons

Main gun

Nansen: OTO Melara 76 mm Super Rapid.
Wikipedia

F110: Leonardo 127/64 LW (127 mm) — heavier firepower and naval gun support/longer range.
Outono

VLS & anti-air

Nansen: Mk-41 VLS (forward module, used to carry ESSM; Nansen fit is an 8-cell module with capacity to host multiple ESSMs via “pack” loading). Uses RIM-162 ESSM for self-defence.
Wikipedia
+1

F110: Mk-41 VLS (documented as 16 cells in published specs for the class) and RIM-162 ESSM Block 2 selected as primary AAW self-defence missile. F110 carries a larger VLS installation than Nansen.
Outono
+1

Anti-ship (surface strike)

Nansen: Kongsberg Naval Strike Missile (NSM) in an octuple surface launcher for long-range ASuW.
Wikipedia

F110: Spain selected NSM as Harpoon replacement and F-110 is planned to be fitted with NSM for anti-ship/land-attack roles.
Kongsberg
+1

Anti-submarine weapons

Both have light-weight torpedo tubes (324 mm) and torpedo launch capability; Nansen uses Sting Ray torpedoes originally; F110 will carry torpedo/ASW capability teamed with helicopter/UUV & towed sonar.
Wikipedia
+1

CIWS / point defence / decoys

Nansen: Remote weapon stations (Kongsberg SeaPROTECTOR), DL-12T decoy launchers, Loki torpedo countermeasure.
Wikipedia

F110: modern self-defence suite integrated into SCOMBA; specific CIWS packages vary in sources, but F110 emphasises layered defence (ESSM + close-in systems + decoys) and advanced ESM/decoy integration.
Naval News
+1

Sensors & combat systems

Primary combat system

Nansen: Aegis (AN/SPY-1F tied into Aegis combat system/databuses) — classic Lockheed approach used on the Álvaro de Bazán derivatives.
Wikipedia
+1

F110: SCOMBA (Spanish/Navantia combat system — “local Aegis-like”) as the ship’s brain, with heavy domestic integration (Indra + Navantia). F110 is built to be data-centric (integrated services, digital twin).
Wikipedia
+1

Radars & mast

Nansen: AN/SPY-1F multi-function radar (Aegis family) + additional surveillance radars (Reutech RSR 210N etc.).
Wikipedia

F110: modern integrated mast with Indra AESA S-band radar and multi-sensor mast concept (Protec-110 consortium) — designed to reduce signature and centralise sensor fusion.
Joint Forces News
+1

Sonar / ASW sensors

Nansen: Bow/hull-mounted sonar (MRS 2000 or Spherion/MRS variant) + CAPTAS (CAPTAS Mk II towed array on Nansen) — strong ASW fit.
Naval Technology
+1

F110: hull-mounted sonar + CAPTAS-4 (Compact) low-frequency towed array planned/announced for F110; ship designed around modern ASW (helicopter + UUVs + VDS).
The War Zone
+1

Helicopter / unmanned systems

Nansen: hangar/flightdeck for ASW helicopter (originally NH90 program, now transitioning; Norway moving to MH-60R for ASW).
Wikipedia

F110: hangar & large flightdeck for one/two naval helicopters (NH90 / MH-60R planned) and explicit space for UxV/UAVs — emphasis on modular mission bay and unmanned systems.
VPK
+1

Platform / systems integration / automation / mission support

Nansen: conventional bridge/PLT integration typical of early-2000s first-line frigates; fitted with NATO datalinks (Link-11, fitted for Link-16/22) and mature Aegis integration.
Wikipedia

F110: strong emphasis on automation, digital twin, integrated platform control (SICP/IPMS) and on-board data services to enable predictive maintenance, lower crew and modular mission packages. Navantia/Indra heavily involved.
Naval News
+1

What’s common (short)

Shipbuilder / design lineage: Both trace back to Navantia/Álvaro-de-Bazán family involvement (Nansen was built by Bazan/Navantia; F110 is a Navantia design).
Wikipedia
+1

VLS + ESSM: Both use Mk-41 VLS and ESSM (ESSM Block variants) for anti-air self-defence — Nansen with a smaller forward Mk-41 module, F110 with a larger Mk-41 fit.
Wikipedia
+1

ASW emphasis & toolkit: Both carry hull sonar + towed array (CAPTAS family) + ship-borne ASW helicopter + 324 mm torpedoes — both are optimized for submarine detection/prosecution.
Naval Technology
+1

NSM for ASuW: Both navies are fielding NSM for ship-launched anti-ship capability (Norway already, Spain selected NSM to replace Harpoon and fit F110).
Wikipedia
+1

Key differences (short)

Combat system & radar philosophy: Nansen = Aegis / SPY-1F (PESA era Aegis derivative). F110 = SCOMBA + Indra AESA integrated mast (new-generation integrated mast / sensors / processing). That’s a major architectural difference in how sensors & weapons are fused.
Wikipedia
+1

Size & payload: F110 is larger (~6,100 t vs ~5,300 t) and has more VLS cells (16 vs ~8) and a bigger main gun (127 mm vs 76 mm) — so more endurance, modularity and striking power.
Seaforces
+1

Automation / digital twin / mission growth: F110 explicitly designed for a high degree of automation, a digital twin and future-proofing for unmanned systems; Nansen is a slightly older design (mid-2000s) with later upgrades planned.
Naval News
+1

How much is common? (practical answer)

If you break ship systems into categories (hull/propulsion, combat system, sensors, weapons, ASW kit, aviation, C2/integration), my rough, evidence-based read is:

~60% commonality in mission fit and major components: both are modern ASW frigates with VLS + ESSM, towed sonar, ASW helicopter capability, NSM for anti-ship and similar torpedo suites. Those core mission systems (ASW focus, AAW self-defence via ESSM, anti-ship via NSM) are shared.
Wikipedia
+2
The War Zone
+2

~40% difference in systems architecture & growth path: the combat system/radar approach (Aegis/SPY-1F vs SCOMBA + Indra AESA mast), main gun calibre, VLS cell count, degree of built-in automation/digital twin, and sensor fusion philosophy are noticeably different. That means while many missiles, torpedoes and sonars are common, how they’re fused and the overall operational concept differs substantially.
Wikipedia
+1

So: many of the weapons/sensors themselves overlap (ESSM, Mk-41, CAPTAS family, NSM), but the software/CSM/radar fusion and platform architecture are where the ships diverge. That makes cross-deck commonality good at the hardware/munition level, but limited at the combat-system / tactical-data‐fusion level.

Norwegian Nansen vs Spanish F110 (Bonifaz) frigates
Category   Fridtjof Nansen class (Norway)   F110 “Bonifaz” class (Spain)
Displacement / size   ~5,200–5,300 t, 134 m   ~6,100 t, 145 m
Builder / heritage   Navantia (Bazan), derivative of Álvaro de Bazán   Navantia (new design, evolved from Bazán)
Combat system   Aegis (Lockheed), AN/SPY-1F radar   SCOMBA (Spanish), Indra integrated mast, AESA radars
Main gun   OTO Melara 76 mm Super Rapid   Leonardo 127/64 LW (127 mm)
VLS / AAW   8-cell Mk-41 (quad-packed ESSM Block 1), local area defence   16-cell Mk-41 (ESSM Block 2), larger area/self-defence envelope
Anti-ship missiles   Kongsberg NSM (8 launchers)   Kongsberg NSM (planned fit)
ASW weapons   2 × triple 324 mm torpedo tubes (Sting Ray); ASW helicopter (NH90 → MH-60R)   2 × triple 324 mm torpedo tubes; ASW helicopter (NH90 / MH-60R); space for UUVs
Sonars   Hull sonar + CAPTAS Mk II towed array   Hull sonar + CAPTAS-4 (Compact) towed array
Decoys / CIWS   SeaPROTECTOR RWS, DL-12T decoys, Loki torpedo countermeasure   Integrated decoys/ESM; CIWS TBD (layered defence planned)
Helicopter facilities   Hangar & deck for 1 × ASW helicopter   Hangar & deck for 1–2 helicopters, plus UAV/UxV capability
Networking   NATO datalinks (Link-11/16/22) via Aegis   NATO datalinks via SCOMBA; strong cyber/data integration
Automation / mission systems   Early-2000s standard automation   High automation, digital twin, modular mission bay
Commonalities

Both: Mk-41 + ESSM, NSM anti-ship, towed sonar + hull sonar + ASW helo, 324 mm torpedoes.

Both: Navantia design heritage, NATO-standard datalinks.

Both: Strong ASW orientation (especially with CAPTAS + helicopters).

Differences

Combat system & radar philosophy: Aegis/SPY-1F vs SCOMBA + Indra AESA mast.

Size & firepower: F110 is larger, with double VLS cells and a heavier 127 mm gun.

Automation: F110 has built-in digital twin, modularity, unmanned systems integration; Nansen does not.

➡️ In essence: ~60% common in weapons/sensors, ~40% diverging in combat system architecture and growth path.