6 Geração

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Cabeça de Martelo

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #45 em: Abril 02, 2025, 12:59:40 pm »
7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.

 

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Pilotasso

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #46 em: Abril 18, 2025, 03:54:37 pm »
 
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MMaria

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Duvidar faz-te pensar... acreditar sem duvidar faz-te um fanático.
 

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #48 em: Abril 23, 2025, 05:04:05 pm »
« Última modificação: Abril 23, 2025, 05:04:25 pm por Cabeça de Martelo »
7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.

 

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os_pero

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #49 em: Abril 24, 2025, 10:15:29 am »

Eu desconfio tanto deste avião, há analistas que dizem que ele tem 3 motores porque os motores Chineses não tem potencia suficiente para serem só 2, e os motores chineses também não são conhecidos pela sua eficiência de combustível, e logo ter 3 motores desconfio que o alcance não deverá ser dos melhores  :-\  (mas isto sou só eu que nada sei a especular).
 

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Cabeça de Martelo

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #50 em: Abril 24, 2025, 11:54:59 am »
O que me parece é que todos os caças de 6ª geração que estão a ser pensados, projetados ou voados, têm alcances muito maiores do que os de 5ª geração. Presumo que seja porque estão pensados para o combate na Ásia (as distâncias são muito superiores ao que seria necessário para uma operação no continente Europeu).

Em relação à potência...presumo (não tendo a certeza) que tenhas razão em relação a esse aspecto.
7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.

 

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os_pero

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #51 em: Abril 24, 2025, 12:07:00 pm »
O que me parece é que todos os caças de 6ª geração que estão a ser pensados, projetados ou voados, têm alcances muito maiores do que os de 5ª geração. Presumo que seja porque estão pensados para o combate na Ásia (as distâncias são muito superiores ao que seria necessário para uma operação no continente Europeu).

Em relação à potência...presumo (não tendo a certeza) que tenhas razão em relação a esse aspecto.

Pois eu há tempos estive a ler e a ver uns "artigos" sobre o caça naval Chinês e eles tem o enorme problema (ao ponto da operação desses caças ser muito limitada pois só conseguem aterrar nos porta-aviões sem equipamentos nenhuns, depósitos, armamento,... ou tem de aterrar numa base aérea o que também é um problema pois mesmo com tanques externos a autonomia é baixa) pela falta de potencia, peso, economia desses motores (que tanto quanto percebi são baseados em motores Russos mas desenvolvidos e fabricados na China), e pelo que percebi eles só tem esses motores, logo calculo que os motores usados neste avião serão os mesmos, o que desconfio seriamente no alcance que o avião pode ter se usava de facto esses motores.

Ou seja eu não quero desdenhar o avião Chinês (pois até acho que os Chineses já não são aquela paródia que eram e evoluíram muito) mas tenho aquela sensação que os Chineses estão a tentar passar a imagem de algo que o avião ainda não é (6º geração).
 

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Cabeça de Martelo

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #52 em: Abril 24, 2025, 04:28:52 pm »
7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.

 

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Cabeça de Martelo

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #53 em: Abril 24, 2025, 04:42:15 pm »
O que me parece é que todos os caças de 6ª geração que estão a ser pensados, projetados ou voados, têm alcances muito maiores do que os de 5ª geração. Presumo que seja porque estão pensados para o combate na Ásia (as distâncias são muito superiores ao que seria necessário para uma operação no continente Europeu).

Em relação à potência...presumo (não tendo a certeza) que tenhas razão em relação a esse aspecto.

Pois eu há tempos estive a ler e a ver uns "artigos" sobre o caça naval Chinês e eles tem o enorme problema (ao ponto da operação desses caças ser muito limitada pois só conseguem aterrar nos porta-aviões sem equipamentos nenhuns, depósitos, armamento,... ou tem de aterrar numa base aérea o que também é um problema pois mesmo com tanques externos a autonomia é baixa) pela falta de potencia, peso, economia desses motores (que tanto quanto percebi são baseados em motores Russos mas desenvolvidos e fabricados na China), e pelo que percebi eles só tem esses motores, logo calculo que os motores usados neste avião serão os mesmos, o que desconfio seriamente no alcance que o avião pode ter se usava de facto esses motores.

Ou seja eu não quero desdenhar o avião Chinês (pois até acho que os Chineses já não são aquela paródia que eram e evoluíram muito) mas tenho aquela sensação que os Chineses estão a tentar passar a imagem de algo que o avião ainda não é (6º geração).

Isso não será porque até ao Fujian, todos os PA chineses eram lançavam os seus aviões através do ski-jump? É que a partir do Fujian, os PA chineses serão comparáveis aos da Marinha Norte-Americana (lançamentos com o sistema Catapult Assisted Take-Off But Arrested Recovery) e em breve serão equipados com os J-35.



Simulação:





« Última modificação: Abril 24, 2025, 04:43:42 pm por Cabeça de Martelo »
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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #54 em: Abril 29, 2025, 04:46:53 pm »

Citação de: 笑脸男人
Hanwha Aerospace  latest promotional video,  featured a conceptual animation of a sixth-generation fighter. Hanwha plans to use domestically developed Korean engines for the  KF-21 Block 3 fighter, and the engine for the future sixth-generation fighter will be developed based on this foundation.






7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.

 

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Re: 6 Geração
« Responder #55 em: Hoje às 05:05:17 pm »
Tempest Future Fighter Aims For “Really Extreme Range,” Twice F-35 Payload
We're getting a clearer picture of what the Global Combat Air Program 'fighter' will be capable of, including acting as a flying computer server.
Thomas Newdick

The U.K. Royal Air Force officer in charge of defining requirements for the Tempest future fighter says the program’s top priority is a large payload — roughly twice that of the F-35A stealth fighter. The same officer says the service is eyeing “really extreme range” for the new aircraft, with potentially enough internal fuel to fly across the Atlantic without refueling. These requirements provide some more ideas about the size and capabilities of the sixth-generation stealth fighter and also parallel similar concerns that have driven the development of the U.S. Air Force’s Boeing F-47 under the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) initiative.



The comments came from an officer known only as Group Captain Bill, who heads up the Requirement and Concepting team for the U.K. Ministry of Defense. This department is charged with defining the capabilities that the Tempest needs to meet the Royal Air Force’s evolving operational requirements. He was speaking earlier this month on a special edition of Team Tempest’s Future Horizons podcast, partnered with the Royal Air Force’s InsideAIR official podcast.

GCAP, or Global Combat Air Program, is the effort under which the United Kingdom’s Tempest next-generation fighter is being developed, in partnership with Italy and Japan — the podcast raised the possibility that, once in service, the aircraft itself might not be known as Tempest, although that would still seem the most likely name for the Royal Air Force, at least.

A demonstrator for the Tempest program is now being built, although its precise relationship to the final aircraft is not completely clear. The aircraft is supposed to take to the air in 2027.

Meanwhile, a Boeing 757-based flying testbed for the Tempest program, named Excalibur, is also now flying, with its sensors planned to include the Multi-Function Radio Frequency System radar from Leonardo, plus communications systems and electronic warfare equipment.

More broadly, for the United Kingdom specifically, the Tempest will be part of the Future Combat Air System (FCAS) program, a wide-ranging air combat initiative that also includes next-generation weapons, uncrewed platforms, networks and data sharing, and more.



Bill described the plan for Tempest, as the core platform within the FCAS system of systems, to be a “quarterback.” This is a term that’s cropped up before for emerging and future combat aircraft missions, as well as existing 5th generation fighters. The latter use their superior situational awareness and survivability to operate forward as a force multiplier for less capable assets. In terms of 6th generation tactical jets, it also refers to the ability to control uncrewed Collaborative Combat Aircraft (CCAs) and/or other drones, as well as networked weapons.

“It’s the platform that walks onto the field knowing the plan,” Bill continued. “It understands what plans it has available, it’s no longer able to maintain the connection back to the coach on the sidelines because you’re too deep into the field, and the other players that are there in that team, some of those will be expendable. They will not make it through the play that we’re executing, and that play will not go to plan either. The quarterback needs to have the ability, the strategic vision, and the reactions to be able to deal with what plays out when they start and then pick how it’s then going to deliver the tasks to what remains on the field, to look at what’s going on and then decide how it achieves the aim. It’s survivable enough to take a hit if needs be, it’s no kind of fragile back-row player. Also, if need be, it can score a touchdown itself. But the aim here is that it’s going to orchestrate many others, many other parts in that system of systems.”



“This aircraft is going to approach replacing Typhoon in a different way,” Bill said. “The threat environment means that range has become a really big thing for all of us.”

This is something that’s being recognized in sixth-generation combat aircraft programs around the world, whether in NGAD in the United States or in broadly similar Chinese developments.

For the Tempest program, the kind of threat environment envisaged means that the fighter will likely “have to leave the tanker a long way behind” in various combat scenarios. This is pushing the demand for “really extreme range, kind of maybe getting across the Atlantic to America on internal fuel.” This compares with the Typhoon, which would normally need three or four tanker hook-ups to cover the same distance.

“We’re building an aircraft that is going to have an awful lot of range,” Bill continued, “but at the top of our list is the payload.”

“Payload is what we’re all about,” Bill emphasized. “In fact, in pure capability terms, I don’t care how I get [the payload] there. It could be in the back of an A400, from a submarine, or from space. It just so happens that our analysis tells us the best way to get that payload there right now is in a fast jet. But the payload, now you’d expect weapons to be in there. So that’s obvious, and boy, will we have weapons.”

According to Bill, the Tempest will have roughly double an F-35A’s worth of payload. It’s unclear how this would be broken down in terms of fuel and weapons, but just in terms of internal and external ordnance, for the F-35A, this equates to more than 18,000 pounds, according to the manufacturer. Considering the Tempest’s mission, as described above, this is likely referring to internal payload, which would put it at around 10,000lbs compared to the F-35A’s 5,000lbs — two 2,000lb-class guided bombs plus a pair of AIM-120s. This would be an impressive load and would give Tempest quite an arsenal of its own.



The weapons that would fill its big bays are also expected to include new types of missiles now in development. Here, there will very likely be a focus on ultra-long-range air-to-air missiles.




While Bill said the Tempest should not be characterized specifically as a specialist for beyond-visual-range combat, it’s clear there is also an expectation that it should defeat aerial threats at longer ranges than the Typhoon, for example:

“I think the idea of defeating an enemy by turning harder, we have to ask ourselves, is that necessarily the way you want GCAP to fight? Tempest may be able to defeat a threat without needing to turn at all, and that’s a really bold statement to make, remember, because we made that statement once before in the 1960s with Phantom where we said maneuverability was no longer a thing, and that missiles would be able to do the job, and radars would be able to do the job. That turned out to be the wrong assessment, and we had to go through a whole cycle to get ourselves back to a place where we understood how we were going to use combat air. So we’re not making any of these kinds of statements lightly. There’s an awful lot of analysis that goes on behind it, but I wouldn’t characterize GCAP as only a long-range platform at all.”

The prodigious payload for the Tempest will not just be made up of fuel and weapons.

Just as important will be the sensors, especially bearing in mind the envisaged quarterback role.

“Everywhere GCAP goes, it carves a picture of the world to support other military capabilities, to be able to exploit that, use that,” Bill explained. “And so getting the sensors forward is as important as getting the weapons forward. And those sensors also mean that when we go deep into enemy territory, and we may not be able to reach back to anyone else’s help, [or if] there’s no connection with the E-7 in the future, we still can complete the kill chain, so the ability to find and fix something, to identify it, to engage it, and then work out how that engagement went. We can still do that within our platform or within our formation.”

The final piece of the payload puzzle will be the Tempest’s function in what Bill described as a ‘flying server rack’, specifically in support of complementary drones and other autonomous capabilities, including ones pushed even further forward into the battlespace.

...

https://www.twz.com/air/tempest-future-fighter-aims-for-really-extreme-range-twice-f-35-payload
7. Todos os animais são iguais mas alguns são mais iguais que os outros.