Versão N do Rafale cancelada

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JNSA

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Versão N do Rafale cancelada
« em: Setembro 24, 2004, 07:32:42 pm »
Li no fórum do warships1 que a Marinha francesa tinha cancelado a aquisição dos Rafale N (bi-lugares), apostando apenas numa frota composta por Rafale M (mono-lugar).

Alguém confirma esta notícia?

E quais serão as razões para tal mudança? Ou estão a tentar poupar dinheiro (e eventualmente a diminuir as capacidades de ataque ao solo em detrimento da defesa aérea), ou chegaram à conclusão de que a versão mono-lugar basta, mesmo em missões mais exigentes...
 

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JLRC

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« Responder #1 em: Setembro 28, 2004, 02:05:21 am »
Orders for Rafale Aircraft: Status Report
 
 
(Source: French Ministry of Defence; issued Sept. 24, 2004)
 
 
 (Issued in French only; unofficial translation by defense-aerospace.com)  
As indicated by the Minister of Defence on Sept. 22, 2004, the ministry and the manufacturers involved in the Rafale combat aircraft program have successfully concluded negotiations for a further order of 59 aircraft.  
 
This order is valued at about 3.1 billion euros.  
 
This agreement covers the acquisition of 11 Rafale B two-seater aircraft, 36 Rafale C single-seat air force aircraft and 12 Rafale M naval single-seat aircraft. All of these aircraft will be delivered to the F 3 multirole standard, whose development contract was awarded in February 2004.  
 
The new order will bring to 120 the total number of production Rafale aircraft ordered to date by France, 82 for the air force and 38 for the navy.  
 
It includes remedial action for some electronic components which have become obsolescent, for which an equitable cost-sharing agreement has been concluded.  
 
The new order will be translated into several contract awards to industry, the main contracts going to Dassault Aviation (1.5 billion euros), SNECMA (600 million euros) and Thales (500 million euros). MBDA and SAGEM are also included.  
 
These contracts will be awarded before the end of 2004, at the completion of the review process.  
 
Delivery of the newly-ordered aircraft will take place between June 2008 and January 2012.  
 
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rjales

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« Responder #2 em: Setembro 28, 2004, 09:41:04 am »
Ministère de la Défense - Délégation à l'Information et à la Communication de la Défense.

Paris, le 24 septembre 2004

Commande d’avions Rafale. Point de situation.
Comme l’a indiqué le ministre de la défense le 22 septembre 2004, le ministère de la Défense et les industriels impliqués dans la réalisation de l’avion de combat Rafale viennent d’achever les négociations pour une commande globale de 59 appareils. Le montant de cette commande est de l’ordre de 3,1 milliards d’euros.

Cette commande prévoit l’acquisition de 11 Rafale B biplace air, 36 Rafale C monoplace air et 12 Rafale M monoplace marine. Tous ces avions seront au standard polyvalent F 3, dont le développement a été notifié en février 2004. Elle portera à 120 le nombre total d’avions de série commandés par la France à ce jour : 82 pour l’armée de l’air et 38 pour la marine.

Elle inclut le traitement de l'obsolescence de certains composants électroniques, pour lequel un accord a été trouvé avec l'industrie sur un partage équitable des frais associés.

La commande se déclinera en plusieurs marchés aux différents industriels, les principaux étant Dassault Aviation (1,5 G€), SNECMA ( 0,6 G€), THALES ( 0,5 G€). MBDA et SAGEM figurent également parmi les industriels concernés. La notification des marchés interviendra avant la fin 2004, à l’issue du processus d’approbation.

Les livraisons des appareils ainsi commandés interviendront à partir de juin 2008 et s’étendront jusqu’à janvier 2012.
_________________________

Quanto à sua informação JNSA, que eu saiba o primeiro prototipo da versão N, estara pronto em 2006 para testes no "Charles de Gaulle".

São previstos 60 Rafale "Marine" : 25 na versão "M" e 35 na versão "N".

De realçar que esta ultima versão não dispõe de canhão interno e leva menos 215kg de carburante, o trem reforçado ocupa mais lugar de tal maneira que sera bastante diferente do bilugar da "Armée de l'air", o que implica mais estudos e pesquiças da parte da Dassault.

Sera que estes problemas levaram ao cancelamento do projeto ?
Por enquanto não sei de nada.

Cumprimentos
 

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rjales

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« Responder #3 em: Outubro 07, 2004, 12:21:26 pm »
Afinal os 60 Rafale "Marine" serão monolugares, por uma questião de economia.

Neste link : http://www.reuters.fr/locales/c_newsArt ... ID=6307008

vem o seguinte :

"La ministre de la Défense a indiqué mercredi que tous les Rafale Marine seront livrés en version monoplace, ce qui permettra de réaliser une économie de 60 millions d'euros sur le lot des 59 appareils qui sera prochainement notifié."

Cumprimentos
 

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JNSA

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« Responder #4 em: Outubro 07, 2004, 06:32:20 pm »
Citação de: "rjales"
Afinal os 60 Rafale "Marine" serão monolugares, por uma questião de economia.

Neste link : http://www.reuters.fr/locales/c_newsArt ... ID=6307008

vem o seguinte :

"La ministre de la Défense a indiqué mercredi que tous les Rafale Marine seront livrés en version monoplace, ce qui permettra de réaliser une économie de 60 millions d'euros sur le lot des 59 appareils qui sera prochainement notifié."

Cumprimentos


Obrigado, rjales. Era mesmo essa confirmação que eu queria.

A poupança "directa", na aquisição de aparelhos não é grande, mas a diferença talvez seja ainda maior na redução dos custos com treino de tripulações.

Confirma-se a tendência actual para os caças de última geração serem sobretudo monolugares, mesmo nas missões mais exigentes (ataque, SEAD, anti-navio, etc.) que até agora eram quase sempre entregues a bilugares.
 

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J.Ricardo

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« Responder #5 em: Outubro 07, 2004, 09:30:49 pm »
Se não me falha a memória, os F-16 comprados recentemente por Israel, são em sua maioria biplaces, segundo informações era para futuramente um 2º piloto coordenar um esquadrão de aeronaves não tripuladas, e essa na época era considerada a nova tendência, agora lhes pergunto, hoje qual seria a realmente a nova tendência? Eu acho que por algum tempo, ainda precisaremos de aeronaves especializadas!!! Isso claro qua para quem tiver dinheiro para manter uma força-aérea que comporte esse tipo de missão!
 

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rjales

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« Responder #6 em: Outubro 13, 2004, 08:21:45 am »
No que toca ao cancelamento da versão N do Rafale as rasões são sobretudo orçamentais, e é perciso desenvolver esta versão que ainda não existe (trem e  estrutura reforçados para uso em porta aviões, como na versão M monolugare).
Tambem as versões M e N são estritamente reservadas a um uso naval, não sei quem as ira adequirir a não ser a marinha francesa, ja que a Dassault não consegue vender a versão "terrestre" do rafale no estrangeiro.

Para mais a marinha tem outros programas urgentes em curso :
- versão naval do NH90 para substituição dos Lynx, que não sera feita numero por numero,
- fregatas Horizon para actualisação de sua capacidade escolta AA
- Substituição dos navios de desembarque "Ouragan", pelos da classe "Mistral",
- Segundo porta aviões,
- Novos SNA, etc...

Como se vê não é a utilidade tactica dum caça bilugare que esta em causa, mas sim a falta de dinheiro.

A força aérea francesa mantem suas previsões de 95 monolugares, e 139 bilugares.


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JLRC

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« Responder #7 em: Outubro 14, 2004, 12:00:31 am »
Rafale Order Finalized
 
 
(Source: Snecma; issued Oct. 12, 2004)
 
 
 This announcement comes almost three months after the F1-standard Rafale (air-air) was officially declared operational by Admiral Jean-Louis Battet, Naval Chief of Staff, at a ceremony on the naval airbase of Squadron 12F in Landivisiau. This is the base to which the first production Rafales were delivered in July 2000.  
 
Four years after this first delivery, Admiral Battet’s announcement marks the culmination of a long maturing process in which several Snecma Group companies took part each in their particular domains, ranging from propulsion to equipment. The next stage in the power ramp-up of the “omnifunction” fighter will be the delivery of F2-standard aircraft (air-air and air-ground) to the French Air Force by the end of 2004 for an operational evaluation scheduled to last until 2006.  
 
The entry into operational service of the F1-standard Rafale M (single-seat models of the French Navy) was declared on June 25th on the Landivisiau naval airbase. This facility is the base for the 12F Squadron, the first Fleet Air Arm unit to fly these fighters, located in the Department of Finistère, Brittany. The ceremony gave Admiral Jean-Louis Battet, Naval Chief of Staff, the opportunity to underline the efforts made by the personnel of the French Navy, the DGA (General Delegation for Armament), and the various industrial players involved, in what he described as a “a maturing process spanning four years, from delivery of the first production aircraft in July 2000”.  
 
The attainment of F3 standard, that is to say the validation of the acquisition of new operational modes, primarily concerned the electronic and weapon systems, both of which incorporate several remarkable technological advances. At the same time, dozens of modifications were made to other systems and equipment, with a view to the overall optimization of the Rafale’s performance.  
 
To give an example of this optimization, the first M88-2 engines designed and produced by Snecma Moteurs that equipped the first Rafales delivered to 12F Squadron were provided with retrofit kits to increase the critical component lifetime and reduce fuel consumption. The Rafale engines have fully earned their reputation as true “thoroughbreds”: their power, speed of response, reliability and ease of maintenance have won over all the 12F Squadron personnel, pilots and mechanics alike.  
 
As Lieutenant Christian Cosmo, Head of the Technical Services of the 12F Squadron, points out: “the M88-2 engines have demonstrated excellent reliability in spite of the most taxing climatic conditions: relentless heat and very high levels of humidity. Technical interventions have been very rare, and we have shown that an engine can be replaced in less than one hour. We even managed to remove and reinstall two M88-2 engines in 1 h 45 min. And the modular design of the engines has made maintenance operations considerably easier.”  
 
Another item of equipment produced by a Snecma group company has also proved its worth, namely the landing system designed by Messier-Dowty. This landing system, the only one of its kind in the world, has a “jumper” landing gear capable of springing out when the aircraft is catapulted by the nose-gear strut. In mere fractions of a second, this gives the Rafale – the only delta / canard fighter operating from aircraft carriers – the ideal angle of attack for takeoff. Feedback on the experience in the particularly demanding operating conditions of the Navy has been very favorable, coming from thousands of catapult launch-arrested landing cycles performed by the 12F Squadron aircraft.  
 
Having reached full operational maturity, the F1-standard Rafale has shown itself to be capable of accomplishing the entire spectrum of offensive and defensive air-air missions: air superiority (escort or sweep), sky policing (identification and inspection) and air defense of the Fleet Air Arm Group and of the national territory. The first nine aircraft of the 12F Squadron commanded by Commander Pierre Vandier have totaled more than 4,500 flying hours and 2,000 arrested landings on the Charles-de-Gaulle aircraft carrier.  
 
The know-how acquired by the pilots and technicians of 12F now enables them to use the Rafale to the utmost of its capacities, even in extreme conditions, as they recently demonstrated between March and May during the Agapanthe 2004 deployment in the Middle East and India. The results of engagements against other fighter aircraft used by allied countries exceeded the highest expectations. According to the pilots of 12F Squadron, the Rafale is indeed an exceptional aircraft, and the score of victories obtained against F-14 Tomcats, F-15 Eagles and F/A-18 Hornets is remarkably high.  
 
Entry of the first F2-standard Rafales B/C models (two-seater/single-seater) into service with the French Air Force by the end of 2004 will give a new impetus to the Rafale program, as the progressive build-up to omnifunction capacity is going to be accentuated with the coming deliveries. They should allow the creation of an operational evaluation unit for the new Rafales at Mont-de-Marsan as of the end of the year, and the setting up of the first squadron at Saint-Dizier in 2005. The French Navy, for its part, should start taking delivery of its first Rafale F2s in 2006, with a view to equipping a second Squadron in 2007.  
 
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JLRC

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« Responder #8 em: Dezembro 08, 2004, 05:43:57 pm »
Order Awarded for 59 Rafale Combat Aircraft
 
 
(Source: French Ministry of Defence; issued Dec. 7, 2004)

(Issued in French only; unofficial translation by defense-aerospace.com)
 
 
 PARIS --- Defence Minister Michele Alliot-Marie announced on December 6, 2004, during the Senate debate on the 2005 defence budget, the formal award of an order for 59 Rafale combat aircraft.  
 
This order, awarded by the defence procurement agency, DGA, to Dassault Aviation, covers 47 aircraft for the air force (11 two-seaters and 36 single-seaters) and 12 single-seat aircraft for the navy. All of these aircraft will be delivered to the F3 multi-mission standard, whose development contract was awarded in February 2004. They will be delivered between 2008 and 2012.  
 
The 118 engines needed for the aircraft, as well as the related spare parts, have also been ordered, in two batches, from Snecma Moteurs.  
 
Additional orders are currently being processes for the radars, the countermeasures suites and other equipment intended for these aircraft. The contracts also cover the updating of obsolete electronic components.  
 
In addition to Dassault Aviation ad Snecma, the principal manufacturers concerned by the Rafale combat aircraft program are Thales, Sagem and MBDA.  
 
These latest contracts bring to 120 the number of production-standard Rafale combat aircraft ordered for the French armed forces, including 82 for the air force and 38 for the navy.  
 
The first Rafale-equipped “flotille” (naval aviation squadron) is already in service. The first air force Rafale squadron is scheduled to become operational in 2006.  
 
The latest F3 version of Rafale, which will be capable of operating the ASMP-A improved air-launched nuclear stand-off missile, is to enter operational service in 2008.  
 
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