Portugal e Espanha: Fosso Aumenta

  • 60 Respostas
  • 20668 Visualizações
*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #15 em: Março 30, 2005, 06:13:24 pm »
Citação de: "emarques"
Um artigo interessante publicado no JN um pouco antes das eleições falava do tamanho do monstro da administração pública. Sabiam que, segundo esse artigo, a proporção da nossa população activa empregada na função pública está abaixo da média europeia? Que está abaixo da estado-unidense?

O que nós temos é muito peso do sector público no PIB. Ou seja, até não será o sector público que é grande demais, é o privado que não produz nada de jeito. ;)


Acho que isso é mais "spin" positivo em defesa da manutenção do sector público tal qual é hoje em dia, do que uma avaliação realista do balanço entre o impacto positivo e negativo que o sector publico tem no PIB Portugues.

Fazer uma correlação entre numero de empregados e gastos financeiros não é uma análize 100% correta.

Eu diria que se a proporção da população empregada na função pública é abaixo da média, mas mesmo assim tem um enorme peso no PIB, é porque existe um desbalanço entre as capacidades reaís do país, e a forma como governo emprega os recursos que têm à sua disposição.

Facilmente podemos chegar a algumas conclusões:

- Que o governo Português está a gastar o dinheiro que não têm
- Que o governo está a tirar dinheiro a mais do sector privado, e é por isso que esse tem pouca pujança
- Uma combinação dos dois

E qual o resultado real proveniente deste peso do sector público no PIB? Qual seria o resultado se se reduzisse esse peso.

E por ultimo lhe digo que não me surpreende que o peso do PIB do sector público na ecónomia seja demasiadamente grande, como não há de ser? Não vivemos nós num país maioritariamente socialista? Quando se tem governos paternalistas é de esperar que estes tenham um peso enorme na ecónomia, visto que tem que financiar várias áreas da sociadade.
"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

ferrol

  • Analista
  • ***
  • 710
  • +0/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #16 em: Março 31, 2005, 02:22:09 pm »
Citação de: "Tiger22"
O ferrol é que parece que só lê “enlaces” o que tem os seus inconvenientes.
Sí, que un pode opinar sen temor a se trabucar, porque se o fai, faino con base ó que din outras páxinas, non o propio maxín.


Citação de: "Tiger22"
Isto é, se ao tal crescimento espanhol retirar a “bolha” da especulação imobiliária, o aproveitamento vergonhoso da mão de obra clandestina e os fundos estruturais, esse crescimento ficaria muito alem daquele que é actualmente.
Efectivamente, e se Corea non tivese salarios tan baixos, non tería ese crecemento, e se Alemaña non invirtise tanto en I+D tampouco medraría tanto...

Cada país ten os séus métodos para medrar, e os de España non pasan polo "aproveitamento vergonhoso da mao de obra clandestina" máis que en calquera outro lugar da Europa, polo que iso non é un factor decisivo en que medre ou non a nosa economía. ¿Póñolle un gráfico onde se demostra isto ou tamén lle parece un "enlace inconveniente"?

Citação de: "Tiger22"
Se eu quiser comprar produtos que não se podem adquirir no mercado “tradicional” sabe onde os compro? Não, não é em Portugal é em Espanha. Muitas vezes são as próprias pessoas que descaradamente me contactam. Em Portugal isso é impensável.
Pois verá vostede, España ten un mercado libre, polo que se pode vender de todo o que sexa legal... se vostede quere mercar cousas non legais, pois evidentemente terá que ir ó mercado negro. Non esperará que se venda droga no "Carrefour" ¿verdade? En España, iso tamén é impensable.


Citação de: "Tiger22"
Portugal só teve um ano com crescimento negativo, em 2003 com -1,2, mas já em 2004 o PIB cresceu 1,1. Esta situação é comum numa Europa onde o principal motor da economia, a Alemanha, está a atravessar uma crise sem precedentes.
Perdon, España é Europa e leva medrando por riba do 2,5% desde 1.997, polo que esa "situación común" seráo para aqueles países que non se adaptan ben ós tempos modernos.


Citação de: "Tiger22"
O limite de 3% do deficit só foi ultrapassado uma vez e não foi graças ao anterior governo…
Tendo a pensar que a responsabilidade dun país non se mide por quen goberna, senón polas tendencias dos gobernantes, e Portugal leva varios anos con déficit, en varios gobernos distintos...

Citação de: "Tiger22"
Para mim os portugueses são especiais, são... superiores.
Pero iso non é culpa súa, home. Iso é culpa da educación que lle deron. Porque claro, ¿todos os portugueses son superiores en todo ós demáis? Perdoe que me ría, iso é para os cativos de 5 anos que pensan que os seus pais son os mellores, as persoas maiores sabemos que iso non é certo.

Citação de: "Tiger22"
Sempre fomos os primeiros em tudo que a Espanha depois copiou.
Por iso Colón descubríu América para España despois de que o rexeitaran en Portugal...

De todos xeitos, estamos nun foro militar, fagamos unha cousa, recorramos uns poucos inventos militares, se lle parece:
- ¿Quen inventou o avión de despegue e aterraxe vertical, coñecido primeiro como "autogiro" e logo como "helicóptero"?

- ¿Quen desenrolou o primeiro "contratorpedeiro" do que logo se chamou "destructor"?

- ¿Quen inventou o galeón e por qué?

- ¿Ten algo que ver Monturiol no desenrolo do submarino?¿Que era o Ictineo?
As respostas, coma sempre, nos libros...

Citação de: "Tiger22"
Os espanhóis sempre menosprezaram África, não a percebem nem a querem perceber, mas para nós portugueses África faz parte do nosso ser. Precisamos de estreitar relações tanto com o Brasil como com esses países africanos que você despreza.
África desprézase a si mesma cando se entrega a guerras entre tribos ou relixións, por diamantes ou por causa de caudillos dictadores...non é España ou Europa a que asasina Hutus en Ruanda, ou mata de fame ós compatriotas en Etiopía... son os propios africanos o que o fan. Menosprézanse eles mesmos que non saben ou poden gobernarse a sí mesmos...


Citar
El banco de españa avisa del riesgo de un 'ajuste brusco' en la vivienda [...] :roll:
Pois ese enlace llo pide a P44, que é o que deu a información neste mesmo foro...

Citação de: "Tiger22"
Sáudo ferrol, e informe-se, que não é nada mau nem faz mal a ninguém.
É inquietante comprobar como pide vostede que me informe, cando eu coloco enlaces públicos, buscados para forma-la miña opinión, e vostede só acerta a dicir que "os portugueses somos superiores"... curioso sentido da información o que ten vostede. :?

Pero non fagamos desta discusión algo persoal, vostede ten a educación que lle deron, e eu teño a miña. Se vostede cre firmemente en todo o que escribíu pois noraboa por mante-las súas crenzas a pesar da realidade. Non lle boto nada en cara, porque só somos o resultado do que outros nos ensinaron, así que vostede é só un reflexo do entorno no que vive.

Un saúdo a todos.
Tu régere Imperio fluctus, Hispane memento
"Acuérdate España que tú registe el Imperio de los mares”
 

*

nestor

  • Membro
  • *
  • 225
  • +0/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #17 em: Abril 01, 2005, 11:12:28 am »
Citar
Para mim os portugueses são especiais, são... superiores. Basta ler a história. Sempre fomos os primeiros em tudo que a Espanha depois copiou.



Ante semejante argumento no se que mas que puede discutir con este foro.

Saludos
 

*

Dinivan

  • Membro
  • *
  • 194
  • +0/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #18 em: Abril 01, 2005, 11:20:30 am »
Citar
Citar
ferrol escreveu:
Portugal, pola contra, é o pais que maís ingresos "per cápita" recibe de Europa, pero o seu PIB descende e se alonxa da converxencia europea...  

Não há um enlace para confirmar esta afirmação?  



http://service.spiegel.de/cache/interna ... 46,00.html

Y esta página explica de una forma muy sencilla el presupuesto de la UE, aunque sus datos no son muy recientes (los del gráfico son del año 2004).
http://www.terrywynn.com/eubudget/index.shtml
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #19 em: Abril 02, 2005, 06:32:04 pm »
De

www.workforall.org.

um instituto europeu dedicado ao estudo do impacto das políticas de impostos governamentaís na ecónomia. Na análize feita para diferenciar os resultados obtidos pelos Irlandeses versus os Belgas, substituam os Belgas pelos Portugueses.
===============================================

CAUSES OF GROWTH DIFFERENTIALS IN EUROPE
Tax policies for growth and job creation.


 
A number of factors that boost prosperity are known from the economic literature.  It is known for long that there is a robust negative relation between tax burden and prosperity growth.  Gwartney and also Laffer and Armey have performed pioneering investigation on this subject.  Gwartney examined the causes of growth differentials between the OECD countries over a long period of 1960 until 1996.  He found that in countries and periods in which government spending was smaller than 25% of GDP rose on average with 6.6%.   Countries with government spending over 60% realized growth rates of 1,6% only.  In his research, he found strong evidence of the robust negative relationship between government spending -and therefore indirectly tax burden - and prosperity growth.  

This relationship appears also evidently from the spreadsheet between growth and public spending in the EU-countries.  A yet stronger negative relationship appears on the spread diagram between prosperity growth and taxation on wages: the higher the tax burden, the lower the growth.

« Última modificação: Abril 02, 2005, 06:56:50 pm por dremanu »
"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #20 em: Abril 02, 2005, 06:35:47 pm »


The workforall group has examined no less then 25 possible causes of growth differentials in the same manner.  Among others the influence of age structure, the level of education, inflation, annual working hours, saving rates, the interest rates, the proportion between direct and indirect tax, size of public spending, the influence of the accession to the EU, etc. All these data are known from the OECD, and were processed in an encompassing multiple regression model, in which time lags of zero to four year were incorporated.  

Multiple regression analysis allows calculating with mathematical precision the exact individual effect and the relative weight of many simultaneously playing factors.  It is with the same technique, that medical science establishes relationships between living or feedings habits on our health, life expectation or illness phenomena.  On our website, one can examine the results of our investigation.  http://www.workfo...  

The most important conclusion from this regression, which explained for 93% of the growth differentials, is that two main causes lead to poor growth performances.  Excessive government spending on the one hand and a de-motivating tax structure, with heavy burdens on work, income and profit on the other hand.  These two factors appeared by far the most important of the 25 causes examined to determine prosperity growth.  

As a decrease in government spending by 1% for instance leads to an additional annual growth rate of 0.6%.  The results of our investigation are confirmed at large in an IMF study of July 2004.  The IMF used the identical research technique, but examined a different country group over a different period.

Furthermore, it appeared from the figures "deficit spending" and lowering interest rates had no positive effect on economic growth whatsoever.  This in contrast to what the believers in Keynesian policies continue to pretend.

"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #21 em: Abril 02, 2005, 06:41:51 pm »
In order to illustrate the findings we have therefore compared two countries with totally opposite economic and fiscal policies: Belgium and Ireland.  

n 1985, Ireland's economical situation was dramatic, and much worse than Belgium’s: excessive budgets deficits, weak growth performances, and a wealth that amounted to only 65% of the Belgian level. In addition, Irish unemployment outfigured the Belgian one by 17% to 10%.  Until 1985 both countries followed similar Keynesian policies and let government spending derail.  In 1983 Belgian public spending exceeded the psychological cape of 50% of the GDP...  

This excessive spending was accompanied by a continuous increase of the tax burden, state debt, and much unproductive public spending.  The negative spiral was initiated.  On the graphics one notices that until 1980 Irish public spending evolved approximately similarly with the Belgian, and growth performances of both countries also paralleled.  

In 1985 Ireland however changed policies dramatically.  They drastically lowered the tax burden.  All superfluous government spending was dropped, and in three years time the public spending was lowered with no less then 20%.  In this way Ireland gave the start to a period of explosive wealth growth averaging 5.6% in the period 1985 until 2002.  This is roughly the triple of the Belgian growth rate.  

Belgium chose for a very different policy.  Belgium barely lowered the tax burden at all, but tried to boost the economy with all sorts of micro-measures. Even under favorable cyclical conditions, public spending remained above the 50% GDP level.  Under these policies, growth stagnated around the 1,9%.  In 2003 the authorities still took 51.4% of the Bealgian wealth creation. In the meantime Irish Authorities had had pushed back public spending to  35.2% of GDP.  



Today Belgian public spending is 46% larger than the Irish is, and the growth rate differential is accordingly. Although the Irish prosperity in 1970 was barely half Belgium's, today it is significantly larger.  

As consequence of unequaled wealth growth Irish authorities today have large margins for all sorts of social, cultural and environment-initiatives as in absolute terms Irish government disposes of more resources than the Belgians do.

However, the Irish wealth is still felt best in purses of its citizens.  The increase of the BNP/head by 167% in a 17-year period with an additional drop in the tax burden of one-third amounts to a multiplication of disposable income with no less than a factor 3.5. Can you imagine what this means?



One notices this wealth explosion when one visits Ireland in all aspects of daily life; one notices the unequaled optimism.  Around Dublin, a forest of tower cranes limits the skyline. In the countryside new houses everywhere, the newest car models, modern factories and offices.  One also notices it in the reorganization of people’s neighborhoods, and in the care they spend at the environment.  The wealth is visible in the absence of criminality and in the view of unclosed cars. One reads also luck in the ey now climbes of people, in the birth rate, and in the welfare-ranking.  In this ranking Ireland hased to number one as the most pleasant country in the world to live in.  

Very impressive performance indeed.  How does such a turnaround to a production policy happen in practice?  

Fundamentally, such production-stimulating policy consists of a substantial reduction of the tax burden on labor and on profit; in other words a decrease of direct taxes.  This motivates people to go back to work: it stimulates to entrepreneurship, to dare to take risks, to perform some overtime or to delay retirement.  Of course, this does not work with a vague promise for a minor tax cut sometime in the far future as is customary in many countries.  Cuts must be felt immediately and they must be substantial.  

Between 1985 and 2001 Ireland lowered the tax burden on wages from 37% in 1985 to 19.3% in 2001. They roughly halved the burden.  In Belgium the burden on labor even slightly continued to rise from 46% in 1985 until 47.9% in 2001.  Today the Belgian burden on wages is 2.5 times as high as the Irish.  Does it surprises anyone that in Belgium nobody wants to do an hour overtime, and that businesses run away from the country in an ever faster rate?  

However, it was the cut of the rates on company profits that led to the greatest improvement of the entrepreneurial climate.  When Ireland was at the bottom its crisis in 1985 tax burden on company profits amounted to no less than 50%.  In 2002, Ireland had reduced that tariff to 16%.  

Belgian rate cuts on the contrary were marginal, and clearly insufficient to raise any effect at all.  The recent decrease of their rates had to be "budgetary neutral" and were compensated by the limitations of many deductions.  In fact, the cut was meant at dressing up internationally published rate tariffs, and had in fact no effect at all.





However, tax cuts mainly profit the rich is it not?

This is exactly the misunderstanding of the ideologists of envy in many countries! Under a production stimulating policy, everyone is better off, and certainly not in the least the worker, unemployed or disadvantaged.  Look at job creation and social expenditures. Since 1985 Ireland crated 31,2% new jobs. In Belgium with its so called social policies and its innumerable expensive employment measures they barely created 7,6%, and for a large part in government employments.



Does a rate cut not lead to a cutback of the social spending?  

A first misunderstanding is to suppose that rate cuts lead to lower tax receipts.  Nothing is less true.  Here the Laffer-effect comes into play.  Every rate cut broadens the tax base because tax evasion and fraud becomes less profitable. The Flamisch government had already a small taste of the benefits of this Laffer-effect. Since they lowered inheritance rates, their tax receipts from inheritances have dramatically risen.

Morover one should remark that lowering inheritance rates does not motivate to die early.  If governments cut rates on incomes however, they may expect the supplementary benefits of the so-called Armey-effects. Low rates on income motivate people to go back to work, to perform some overtime, to start their own business, or to delay retirement. This broadens the tax base still further. Moreover, the financial resources that flow back to the private sector are invested much more productively there than in the public sector.  

Ireland has demonstrated the effectivity of the combined Laffer-Armey effects on direct taxes all to well.  Its tax receipts have continued to rise as the tax burden went down.  

A second miscalculation is to underestimate the dynamics of growth.  As the percentage of the GDP Irish social spending roughly remained constant, just as as the case in Belgium, but the dynamics growth lead to an increase social spending in real terms with 118% between 1980 and 1998.  In Belgium, this was barely 43%.  Such a difference is felt all to well in the purse of the disadvantaged! Ireland has demonstrated that production-stimulating policy is in reality much more social than the Keynesian alternative, meant at boosting consumption.  

"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #22 em: Abril 02, 2005, 06:51:20 pm »
Did Ireland create jobs in all sectors?

Over all sectors, Ireland created 31% new jobs between 1985 and 2002.  In Belgium this was that barely 7,6%.  The highest increase was in services: +106% opposite to +15.8% in Belgium.  However, most remarkably even in industry, Ireland achieved to create 32% new jobs between 1980 and 2003.  In Belgium the industrial employment in 1999 caved in to 75% of the 1980 level. Ever since Belgium has apparetly discontinued to communicate its figures to the OECD. However In agriculture the same evolution took place in both countries: a gradual decrease of the employment.  However, agricultural employment today has a lower impact.  

It is widely believed that European de-industrialization is an unavoidable phenomenon. Ireland has proven that this is not a fatality, and that even an European country can still increase its industrial employment. Even notorious Professor De Grauwe now accepts de-industrialization, and soothes that this is barely a problem as job losses in industry will be absorbed by new jobs in the service sector.  

The big question is of course to whom service sector will sell its services.  Architects will not have to design many factories. Factory floor will not need cleaning, consultants will not have to advise many enterprises, banks won't finance many exports, and even the treasury will not have to control in many places.  Sell services to the unemployed or abroad?  Services are much more labor-intensive still than industry, and please do not believe that Europeans have more brain cells than an average Indian or Chinese.  





However,  many countries still face a huge public debt, their policy margin is very limited.

The gigantic state debt in many countries is the logical consequence of years of fruitless "deficit spending" and sterile Keynesian policies. In Belgium this has culminated under the disastrous administration of socialist minister of budget MATHOT, who went so far as to state publicly that deficits had come by themselves, and would go the same way. Of course, building up such a debt was economic insanity, and a moral injustice to the coming generations. One must get rid of these state debts.  The only question is how.  



One can of course try to reimburse it as fast as possible.  In Belgium, even with their huge savings rate of 14% this would take 8.85 years when they spend all savings on debt reduction. But then nothing remains to invest.  Not a single machine, not a single house.  They could also spread it over 17.7 years, but also then they would need to halve investment with disastrous consequences for the competiviness and the prosperity.  Paying back public debt in this manner is much too slow, and always goes at the expense of investment.

An alternative manner to reduce the proportion Debts/GDP is to focus on the denominator of this fracture, and not on the counter.  In other words, one must aim at a serious growth.  This is exactly what the Irish have done.  

In 1986, Irish public debt amounted to 111% of GDP, almost just as bad as in Belgium with 124%.  The Irish tax cuts however boosted growth to an average 5.6% between 1985 and 2002.  Belgium focused on the counter of the fracture: handing in on almost everything to pay off public debt.  This policy had a deflationary effect and their growth stagnated at 1,9%.  



After 17 year an exponential growth rate differential of over 3% works out to a gigantic difference: Ireland raised its GDP by a factor 2.67; Belgium with a factor 1.42.  In other words Ireland increased the denominator of the fracture public debt / GDP with that factor 2.67, Belgium with that factor 1.42. This way Irish debt will be reduced to 30% GDP in 2005.  With much effort and many new taxes, the Belgian government debt will still be at 98% of the GDP.

What about unemployment under a offer-boosting policy ?



In many countries a very tough misunderstanding persists that available work is a limited static quantity that one should have to share.  Nothing is less true.  Tax cuts are the motor to creativity, to new initiatives and to job creation in the productive sector.  One can notice so in the Irish unemployment statistics.  In 1985, Irish unemployment was much worse than in Belgium:  17% unemployed as compared to 10%.  In 2003 Ireland had reduced the figure to 4,6%.  In reality, this means this that Irish employers are permanently in search of workers, staff and employees, and not the other way around as is the case in Belgium.  

The fear that low rates on profits and low social contributions take away enterprises from other countries is based on the very same misunderstanding.  This reasoning assumes that the number of enterprises and their size are invariable quantities that should be shared among nations. This reasoning assumes that the enthusiasm to work or start one's own business is insensitive to the tax burden. One should know better. When a larger share of the fruit of their labor is allocated to people, their readiness to productive contribution immediately increases.  Low tax burden motivates to work, to perform an hour overtime, to dare the risk of an own business, or to postpone retirement. Politicians who cannot understand this should visit China. On their way home they can have a look at the economic and ecological disasters left behind by the Soviet regime.  

Just as competition between businesses leads to creativity and optimal use of scarce resources, tax competition between nations leads to optimizing the administration.  Each form of tax cartel between nations is as harmful to employment and wealth as monopolies and cartel agreements between businesses are harmful to the size of their sales market. It may be feared that the proposed European constitution will allow imposing by majority rule minimal tax rates on the member states. Countries wanting to adopt similar growth policies as Ireland might find themselves very limitited in their national autonomy to execute economic policies such as decided democratically by their peoples. Under such a European constitution and such a system of minimal tax rates Europe risks perpetuating its stagnant growth which has already lasted for decades now.



Yet it appears contradictory that social spending can rise when tax burden decreases.  
 
The figures of the social expenditure are publicly known on the OECD website !  First misunderstanding is that tax receipts fall when tax-burden falls. For direct taxes the combined Laffer and Armey effects are extremely strong, and Ireland has proven this.  The tax receipts continued to rise under falling tax burden.

A second miscalculation is to look at the relative share of the social expenditures as a percentage of GDP; Look at the absolute figures.  How many benefits do people really receive?  This is what interests the citizens.  In all large sectors of social security the real benefits have raised more in Ireland than in Belgium, except of in the unemployment, but this is due to the drop of the Irish unemployment to one third.  Per unemployed, benefits are now also larger in Ireland than in Belgium.  

Irish are absolute champions in family benefits, in which the child allowances are the main single item.  In 18 years family benefits rose in Ireland by no less than 262%; In Belgium family allowances even slightly went down.  Belgians continued to focus on a shrinkage scenario; savings on welfare reimbursements: they are on the highway to gradual destruction of their social security system.  



If European nations want to preserve their generous social security system in an age of graying population it can only be don by growth, growth, growth once more.  Even the Belgian socialist minister of the budget has now realized this.  Unfortunately, he does not understand that growth can only be achieved through a lightening of the tax burden.  He now wants to force growth by raising the participation rate; shifting the retirement age and measures like that. Again a further cutback on social achievements, and basically a cure of the symptom only. If one wants to cure Belgian's desease of low participation one should tackle the cause which is nothing less than total demotivation due to the laming tax burden.

The Belgian minister does not ask questions who will create the jobs to absorb the higher participation and the raised labor offer. He does not seem to understand that there are no starters any more and that this due to the extreme bad entrepreneurial climate. He does not seem to realize that this due to the high taxation and the relative generosity of the easy and risk free alternatives.

He does not seem to realize that existing businesses are de-localizing at a rate as never seen before. Belgium -and Europe are running empty-.  Under Schroeder, German unemployment increased to over 5 million, just as much as in the 1929 depression.  Under these deflationary shrinkage scenarios, Europe is heading for total collapse.

"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #23 em: Abril 02, 2005, 06:55:10 pm »
An other idea of yours is to shift the tax burden from direct taxes to consumption.  

This is not is just another idea!  This also is one of the main conclusions from our regression-analysis.  We found that countries with higher consumption taxes grow much faster than countries with a higher share of direct taxes.  We therefore fully applaud the basic ideas of the Belgian political party VIVANT who made it one of its prime objectives, and also the recent European initiative of Belgian Prime Minister Verhofstadt.  

The problem is that government expenditures grew explosively since the sixties.  Direct taxes and taxes on business profits have taken the entire burden of this growth.  Family income taxes in Belgium doubled since 1965; taxes on consumption barely changed at all.  



When our social security model was designed, the proportion between direct and indirect tax was balanced. However, in the course of the time, the structure of tax receipts is complete distorted.  Much too high direct taxes de-motivate the active people, and relatively low consumption taxes boost consumption to the disadvantage of investment.  An additional advantage of a consumption tax is that the domestic production no longer bears the whole burden of the social security system, but also products produced abroad are bearing an equal share in the burden.  

A shift of the tax burden can indeed help to boost growth, but the main objective must remain a substantial lightening of the total tax burden.  The IMF comes to the same conclusions in their study of July 2004.

But Is Belgium is now on good track under the liberal-socialist government isn’t it?

Some say so indeed. However, let us look at real figures. Growth is stagnating around 2%, and the authorities still take over 50% of the Belgian wealth creation. This figure belongs to the very highest in the world.  Alarming is that the government spending exclusive interests on state debt has continued to rise from 42.9% in 2000 to 46.1% GDP in 2005.  In other words, the advantage of low interest rates was completely consumed again in all sorts of new expenditures.
 
Without any cut in the budget Belgians could have taken advantage from the evolution on the interest market to decrease Government by more than 3%. However, one has chosen again for new expenditures. .  

One can spend a Euro only once of course. If the authorities chose to do that on all sorts of amusing but unproductive projects, they withhold resources from the private sector, where these resources could be used for more productive uses such as investments in new machinery, new factories, energy efficient houses, or research in new products for instance.  When authorities continue to find ever-new public initiatives, they will of course never be able to lower the tax burden.  

"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

komet

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1662
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +0/-1
(sem assunto)
« Responder #24 em: Abril 02, 2005, 09:22:28 pm »
Ena tantas cores!  :shock:
"History is always written by who wins the war..."
 

*

Luso

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 8530
  • Recebeu: 1622 vez(es)
  • Enviou: 684 vez(es)
  • +940/-7275
(sem assunto)
« Responder #25 em: Abril 02, 2005, 09:42:36 pm »
EXCELENTE Dremanu!
Quem me dera ter visto isto há umas semanas atrás!
Ai de ti Lusitânia, que dominarás em todas as nações...
 

*

emarques

  • Especialista
  • ****
  • 1177
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +1/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #26 em: Abril 04, 2005, 01:18:08 am »
Citação de: "dremanu"
Citação de: "emarques"
O que nós temos é muito peso do sector público no PIB. Ou seja, até não será o sector público que é grande demais, é o privado que não produz nada de jeito. :)

Mas a conclusão que se pode tirar desses valores, juntamente com essa comparação entre a Irlanda e a Bélgica (embora Portugal não seja assim tão "belga" :)[/i]
Ai que eco que há aqui!
Que eco é?
É o eco que há cá.
Há cá eco, é?!
Há cá eco, há.
 

*

Nautilus

  • Membro
  • *
  • 119
  • +0/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #27 em: Abril 10, 2005, 12:36:50 am »
Citar

09-04-2005 13:09:00.  Fonte LUSA.    Notícia SIR-6902098
Temas:  política economia portugal espanha comércio

Sócrates considera relação entre Portugal e Espanha uma prioridade económica

 
Lisboa, 09 Abr (Lusa) - O primeiro-ministro português, José Sócrates, disse hoje que as relações luso-espanholas são uma prioridade da política económica portuguesa, nas vésperas da sua primeira visita oficial ao estrangeiro, a Madrid.

Numa entrevista à agência de notícias espanhola EFE, Sócrates afirma: "Não é por acaso que a minha visita oficial ao exterior, desde que fui eleito primeiro-ministro, é a Espanha". Mostra que Espanha é uma "prioridade clara" para a política económica nacional, acrescenta.

Sócrates vai a Madrid na próxima terça-feira, naquela que é a sua primeira visita oficial ao estrangeiro, depois de ter sido eleito primeiro-ministro de Portugal em Fevereiro.

Durante a campanha eleitoral, Sócrates afirmou que a sua primeira prioridade era Espanha, a sua segunda prioridade era Espanha e a sua terceira prioridade também era Espanha, recorda o chefe do executivo português.

Hoje reforçou esses objectivos, dizendo que vai fazer uma "forte aposta em Espanha, em nome dos interesses portugueses".

Essa aposta justifica-se porque, segundo o primeiro-ministro, "a economia espanhola está a crescer a bom ritmo, acima da média europeia, e isso interessa a Portugal".

Na sua opinião, as relações luso-espanholas "não podem estar condicionadas pela cor política do governo ou pelas suas ideologias", pelo que o Executivo que chefia pretende dar continuidade às relações que têm vindo a ser desenvolvidas pelos anteriores governos.

No entanto, Sócrates não deixa de dizer que tendo agora Portugal e Espanha governos socialistas espera que seja possível tirar partido dessa "união política".

Em relação aos acordos concretos já estabelecidos entre os dois países, como a criação do Mercado Ibérico de Electricidade (MIBEL) e o traçado ferroviário de alta velocidade (TGV), Sócrates diz que "é muito importante manter os calendários para dar credibilidade às decisões tomadas".

O primeiro-ministro português está ainda confiante que os espanhóis vão apoiar a candidatura de António Guterres ao cargo de Alto Comissário das Nações Unidas para os refugiados, já que tanto "Zapatero [primeiro-ministro espanhol] como o ministro dos Negócios Estrangeiros, Miguel Angel, são amigos de Guterres".

IRE.

Lusa/fim

 
 
"Que o país deixe de ter medo!"
Humberto Delgado

Cumprimentos
Nautilus
 

*

dremanu

  • Investigador
  • *****
  • 1254
  • Recebeu: 1 vez(es)
  • +7/-18
(sem assunto)
« Responder #28 em: Abril 22, 2005, 02:00:18 am »
Citação de: "Nautilus"
Citar

09-04-2005 13:09:00.  Fonte LUSA.    Notícia SIR-6902098
Temas:  política economia portugal espanha comércio

Sócrates considera relação entre Portugal e Espanha uma prioridade económica
 
Lisboa, 09 Abr (Lusa) - O primeiro-ministro português, José Sócrates, disse hoje que as relações luso-espanholas são uma prioridade da política económica portuguesa, nas vésperas da sua primeira visita oficial ao estrangeiro, a Madrid.

Numa entrevista à agência de notícias espanhola EFE, Sócrates afirma: "Não é por acaso que a minha visita oficial ao exterior, desde que fui eleito primeiro-ministro, é a Espanha". Mostra que Espanha é uma "prioridade clara" para a política económica nacional, acrescenta.

Sócrates vai a Madrid na próxima terça-feira, naquela que é a sua primeira visita oficial ao estrangeiro, depois de ter sido eleito primeiro-ministro de Portugal em Fevereiro.

Durante a campanha eleitoral, Sócrates afirmou que a sua primeira prioridade era Espanha, a sua segunda prioridade era Espanha e a sua terceira prioridade também era Espanha, recorda o chefe do executivo português.

Hoje reforçou esses objectivos, dizendo que vai fazer uma "forte aposta em Espanha, em nome dos interesses portugueses".

Essa aposta justifica-se porque, segundo o primeiro-ministro, "a economia espanhola está a crescer a bom ritmo, acima da média europeia, e isso interessa a Portugal".

Na sua opinião, as relações luso-espanholas "não podem estar condicionadas pela cor política do governo ou pelas suas ideologias", pelo que o Executivo que chefia pretende dar continuidade às relações que têm vindo a ser desenvolvidas pelos anteriores governos.

No entanto, Sócrates não deixa de dizer que tendo agora Portugal e Espanha governos socialistas espera que seja possível tirar partido dessa "união política".

Em relação aos acordos concretos já estabelecidos entre os dois países, como a criação do Mercado Ibérico de Electricidade (MIBEL) e o traçado ferroviário de alta velocidade (TGV), Sócrates diz que "é muito importante manter os calendários para dar credibilidade às decisões tomadas".

O primeiro-ministro português está ainda confiante que os espanhóis vão apoiar a candidatura de António Guterres ao cargo de Alto Comissário das Nações Unidas para os refugiados, já que tanto "Zapatero [primeiro-ministro espanhol] como o ministro dos Negócios Estrangeiros, Miguel Angel, são amigos de Guterres".

IRE.

Lusa/fim

 
 


Que merda...detesto ser negativo mas dá-me uma raiva quando leio as porcarias que estes governos, que se dizem governos de Portugal, fazem em nome do país. E como sempre o principal objecto da minha raiva são os rascas dos incompetentes dos socialistas.

Porque é que este PM tem que ir a Espanha falar que dar atenção a Espanha é prioridade 1, 2, e 3 do seu governo, e ainda por cima arremata falando em "unidade política". Como é possivel ser tão banana para falar taís coisas. Ainda consegue ser pior que quando o Barroso foi a Espanha dizer que, "Portugal está ao lado de Espanha não importa o quê!", ou algo parecido, já não me lembro.

Emfim, porque é que esta gente não consegue ser só diplomático, sorrir, ser simpático, e no fim não oferecer compromissos nenhuns! Será que eles não entendem que isto automaticamente abre espectativas que podem, ou não, ser dos nossos interesses não cumprir. Mesmo que a Espanha seja realmente uma prioridade, nunca tal deve ser revelado, porque automaticamente os Espanhoís entendem isso como uma brecha que podem explorar em qualquer negociação. Um bom negociador nunca revela de imediato, ou jamais revela, qual é o seu principal objectivo a alcançar.

Não entendo o que é que esta gente tem na cabeça para serem tão levianos na forma como dialogam a nível internacional.

Provavelmente estou errado, mas sei lá, acho isto um grande amadorismo e falta de postura estadista.
"Esta é a ditosa pátria minha amada."
 

*

ferrol

  • Analista
  • ***
  • 710
  • +0/-0
(sem assunto)
« Responder #29 em: Agosto 01, 2005, 07:52:20 pm »
http://www.cincodias.com/articulo.html?xref=20050618cdscdieco_6&type=Tes&anchor=cdscdi&d_date=20050618
Citar
Los analistas elevan al 3,3% el crecimiento español para este año
La economía española crecerá este año un 3,3%, dos décimas más que el pasado ejercicio, según las estimaciones de los analistas consultados por la Fundación de las Cajas de Ahorro (Funcas).
Según los cálculos de estos expertos, la actividad crecerá al ritmo del 3,3% registrado en el primer trimestre de este año (tras la revisión del PIB hecha por el Instituto Nacional de Estadística) hasta el primer trimestre de 2006. Después, a partir de mediados del próximo año la tasa de crecimiento disminuirá una décima, con lo que la media para 2006 se reduciría al 3,2%, según el panel de expertos de Funcas.


Un extracto da nova. Para ler todo o texto, picar no enlace adxunto.
Un saúdo.
Tu régere Imperio fluctus, Hispane memento
"Acuérdate España que tú registe el Imperio de los mares”