Enviado por: Marauder em Agosto 03, 2006, 10:02:40 am
http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=1953479&C=airwar (http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=1953479&C=airwar)
Desprezando valores de contractos de manuntenção, armamento incluído (que não possuo dados):
custo unitário dos F-16 Block 52+ gregos = 66,3(3) milhões de dólares.Acerca do novo concurso para MAIS 30 caças, desta vez de 4ª geração
http://www.menewsline.com/stories/2006/ ... _17_4.html (http://www.menewsline.com/stories/2006/july/07_17_4.html)
Enviado por: pmdavila em Abril 12, 2008, 09:11:02 pm
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Tuesday, 8.04.2008 | Region
Greece buys French planes to show gratitude for support on veto
Athens /08/04/ 16:01
Greece is set to procure fighter jets Rafale and 15 choppers Super Puma from France, Greek daily Kathimerini writes in today's edition.
To this end, Greek Defense Minister Evangelos Meimarakis will be heading to Paris on Thursday to meet his French counterpart Herve Morin.
The paper says that this was another confirmation of the good bilateral relations, after France backed Greece at the NATO Summit in Bucharest, when it stood behind Athens's position to veto Macedonia's invitation for membership in the Alliance. /end/
Copyright 2008 makfax. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed
http://www.makfax.com.mk/look/novina/ar ... Section=20 (http://www.makfax.com.mk/look/novina/article.tpl?IdLanguage=1&IdPublication=2&NrArticle=107944&NrIssue=629&NrSection=20)
Enviado por: Akagi em Abril 20, 2008, 05:28:43 pm
Enviado por: AMRAAM em Abril 20, 2008, 07:26:48 pm
,Grecia gasta el 4'2 % de todo su producto interior bruto en defensa(si no recuerdo mal tiene el mayor gasto en defensa de Europa en relacion a su producto interior bruto expresado en %,sin contar a Rusia) mientras que Portugal gasta solo el 2'3%.Si encima a ello le sumamos que el producto interior bruto de Grecia es casi el doble del de Portugal($232.000 billion para Portugal y $412.521 billion para Grecia,segun la wikipedia),pues la respuesta esta clara.Grecia gasta algo asi como 4 veces lo que Portugal en el campo militar.Todo ello se traduce,en un gran ejercito,como el que tiene grecia,aunque hay que tener en cuenta tambien que ellos tienen un enemigo poderoso como es Turquia,lo que explica ese gran esfuerzo que realizan en defensa.
Enviado por: comanche em Abril 21, 2008, 12:32:25 am
Citação de: "AMRAAM"
Akagi,yo lo veo muy facil
Portugal actualmente não gasta nas forças armadas 2.3% do PIB, mas sim 1.2 a 1.3 % além disso o PIB da Grécia (segundo Wikipédia) é bem mais baixo.
Enviado por: AMRAAM em Abril 21, 2008, 01:50:00 pm
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Portugal actualmente não gasta nas forças armadas 2.3% do PIB, mas sim 1.2 a 1.3 % além disso o PIB da Grécia (segundo Wikipédia) é bem mais baixo.Primero me gustaria puntualizar,que a la hora de buscar datos macroeconomicos referidos a lo que viene siendo el PIB de un pais o a sus gastos en defensa,es muy dificil dar con datos fiables al respecto,ya que dependiendo de la fuente y,sobre todo,de su credibilidad,pues podremos obtener valores mas o menos proximos a la realidad,pero nunca fiables al 100%. :roll:,ya que segun parece,a algun griego se le fue la mano y engordo bastante los datos :wink::
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PORTUGAL ---->3080 mill.$ --->1'6%GDP
GRECIA -------> 7287 mill.$ --->3% GDP
http://www.policyalternatives.ca/documents/National_Office_Pubs/2007/More_Than_the_Cold_War.pdf
Ademas dejo otro enlace con datos al respecto tambien sobre este tema del PIB dedicado en defensa por parte de Grecia y Portugal(se pueden consultar tambien muchos paises),y asi comparar entre distintas fuentes:
http://first.sipri.org/non_first/milex.php
- Finalmente, y en relacion a lo que trata este topic y el comentario que realizo el compañero akagi
,Grecia se puede permitir renovar su flota de cazas sin demasiados problemas debido a que gasta mas de 7000 mill.$ en sus fuerzas armadas.Siendo esto asi,es mas facil,que Portugal tenga mas problemas en el campo militar que grecia ,ya que mientras Portugal gasta mas de 3000mill.$ en defensa los otros gastan mas del doble.
Enviado por: AMRAAM em Maio 04, 2008, 01:03:41 am
According the media the S-3B VIKING is going to be presented to the Hellenic Navy officials ... the navy wants at least 5 aircrafts to replace the P-3B ORIONS
On February 20, 1974, the S-3A officially became operational with the VS-41 Shamrocks Fleet Replacement Squadron. The first operational cruise took place in 1975 with VS-21 Fighting Redtails aboard USS John F. Kennedy (CV-67).
Starting in 1991, some of these were upgraded to the S-3B with a number of new sensors, avionics, and weapons systems, including the capability to launch the AGM-84 Harpoon anti-ship missile. The S-3B can also be fitted with "buddy stores" external fuel tanks that allow the Viking to refuel other aircraft. Sixteen S-3As were converted to ES-3 Shadows for carrier-based electronic intelligence (ELINT) duties. One aircraft, designated US-3A, was also converted for utility and limited cargo duty.[1] Plans were also made to develop the KS-3A carrier-based tanker aircraft to replace the retired KA-6 but this program was ultimately cancelled after the conversion of just one early development S-3A.
Since the submarine threat has been perceived as reduced, the Vikings have had the majority of their antisubmarine warfare equipment removed and are now used primarily for sea surface search, sea and ground attack, over-the-horizon targeting, and aircraft refueling.[1] As a result, crews are now usually limited to two, though three person crews are not unusual with certain missions.
A number of recent upgrade programs have been implemented. These include the Carrier Airborne Inertial Navigation System II (CAINS II) upgrade, which replaced older inertial navigation hardware with ring laser gyroscopes and additional GPS systems, and added electronic flight instruments (EFI). The Maverick Plus System (MPS) added the capability to employ the AGM-65E laser-guided or AGM-65F infrared-guided AGM-65 Maverick air-to-surface missile, and the AGM-84H/K Stand-off Land Attack Missile Expanded Response (SLAM/ER). The SLAM/ER is a GPS/inertial/infrared guided cruise missile that can be controlled by the aircrew in the terminal phase of flight if an AWW-13 data link pod is carried by the aircraft.[1]
The S-3B saw extensive service during the 1991 Gulf War, performing attack, tanker, and ELINT duties, and launching ADM-141 TALD decoys. The aircraft also participated in the Yugoslav wars in the 1990s and in Operation Enduring Freedom in 2001.
Though once considered being replaced by Common Support Aircraft, the original plan failed to materialize. As the surviving S-3 airframes were forced into sundown, a Lockheed Martin full scale fatigue test was performed and extended the service life of the aircraft by approximately 11,000 hours. The current Navy plans call for the retirement of all Vikings by 2009 so new aircraft can be introducted to recapitalize the aging fleet inventory. Their missions will be spread among the other battlegroup fixed-wing and rotary-wing aircraft.
General characteristics
Crew: 4 (Pilot, 2× Naval Flight Officers, Sensor Operator/TFO)
Length: 53 ft 4 in (16.26 m)
Wingspan:
Unfolded: 68 ft 8 in (20.93 m)
Folded: 29 ft 6 in (9.00 m)
Height: 22 ft 9 in (6.93 m)
Wing area: 598 ft² (55.56 m²)
Empty weight: 26,581 lb (12,057 kg)
Loaded weight: 38,192 lb (17,324 kg)
Max takeoff weight: 52,539 lb (23,831 kg)
Powerplant: 2× General Electric TF34-GE-2 turbofans, 9,275 lbf (41.26 kN) each
*Internal fuel capacity: 1,933 US gal (7,320 L) of JP-5 fuel
External fuel capacity: 2x 300 US gal (1,136 L) tanks
Performance
Maximum speed:
429 knots (493 mph, 795 km/h) at sea level
Mach 0.79, 450 knots (514 mph, 828 km/h) at 20,000 ft (6,100 m)
Cruise speed: 350 knots (405 mph, 650 km/h)
Stall speed: 97 knots (112 mph, 180 km/h)
Combat radius: 2,765 nm (3,182 mi, 5,121 km)
Service ceiling 40,900 ft (12,465 m)
Rate of climb: 5,120 ft/min (26.0 m/s)
Wing loading: 68.5 lb/ft² (334 kg/m²)
Thrust/weight: 0.353
Armament
Up to 4,900 lb (2,220 kg) on four internal and two external hardpoints, including:
10× 500 lb (227 kg) Mark 82 bombs
2× 1000 lb (454 kg) Mark 83 bombs
2× 2000 lb (908 kg) Mark 84 bombs
6× CBU-100 cluster bombs
2× Mark 50 torpedoes
4× Mark 46 torpedoes
6× mines or depth charges
2× B57 nuclear bombs
2× AGM-65E/F Maverick missiles
2× AGM-84D Harpoon missiles
1× AGM-84H/K SLAM-ER missile
The two underwing hardpoints can also be fitted with unguided rocket pods or 300 US gal (1,136 L) fuel tanks.
Avionics
AN/APS-116 sea search radar, maximum range 150 nm (173 mi, 278 km)
Upgraded on S-3B to AN/APS-137 Inverse Synthetic Aperture Radar
OR-89 forward looking infrared (FLIR) camera with 3x zoom
AN/ARS-2 sonobuoy receiver with 13 blade antennas on the airframe for precise buoy location
AN/ASQ-81 magnetic anomaly detector (MAD)
AN/ASN-92 inertial guidance system with doppler radar navigation and TACAN
Up to 62 sonobuoys.
(https://www.forumdefesa.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg378.imageshack.us%2Fimg378%2F3687%2Fs3bhawaiirampkm2.jpg&hash=dc375347d24a1b0648e55454769bb1b6)
Enviado por: typhonman em Maio 04, 2008, 10:35:11 pm
Enviado por: Bravo Two Zero em Maio 04, 2008, 11:12:33 pm
Citação de: "Typhonman"
Os Gregos ao menos compram tudo
Pois, "aspiradores" com 30 anos.................
Mas :
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Since the submarine threat has been perceived as reduced, the Vikings have had the majority of their antisubmarine warfare equipment removed and are now used primarily for sea surface search, sea and ground attack, over-the-horizon targeting, and aircraft refueling.[1] As a result, crews are now usually limited to two, though three person crews are not unusual with certain missions.
Não estarão os Gregos a comprar "gato" por "lebre" ?
Enviado por: AMRAAM em Maio 13, 2008, 04:58:45 pm
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Greek defence procurement plans 2006-2010
Greece ’s EMPAE defence procurement budget for the period 2006-2010 contains only E2.96 billion (US$3.7 billion) for the launch of new programs, press visitors to the Defendory show in Athens were told on October 2.
In essence, this means that deposits will be paid for these programs during the current five-year plan, with the major payments coming in the EMPAE 2011-2015 plan. This is expected to contain an estimated E15.35 billion (US$19.2 billion), of which some E1.09 billion (US$1.37 billion) will cover payments for older programs.
Key programs
The most important EMPAE programs approved for the 2006-2010 period are, in order of priority:
1) Development of earth stations for the Hellenic Armed Forces’ Satellite Communications System: E161.2 million;
2) Army procurement of 20 NH90 helicopters: E807.5 million;
3) Construction of six new frigates for the Navy: E2.8 billion;
4) Air Force acquisition of 45 Advanced Jet Trainers: E900 million;
5) Air Force procurement of 70 new fighters, including the 30 F-16C/D Block 52+ already ordered: E5.5 billion;
6) Army acquisition of 84 wheeled AFVs: E430.6 million;
7) Navy procurement of five ASW aircraft: E250 million;
8) Navy upgrade of four MEKO frigates: E200 million;
9) Participation in the BOC-HELIOS joint venture: E120 million;
10) Army procurement of 291 tracked IFVs: E1.7 billion;
11) Navy upgrade of Phalanx systems: E85 million;
12) Navy acquisition of five minehunters: E200 million;
13) Air Force procurement of a new fighter Self-Protection Suite: E350 million;
14) Army acquisition of 18 second-hand PzH 2000 Self-Propelled Howitzers: E15 million;
15) Army procurement of 50 amphibious AFVs: E100 million;
16) Navy modification of six S-class frigates to accommodate the S-70B helicopter: E7.2 million;
17) Navy acquisition of two Fast Attack Craft (Missile): E300 million;
18) Air Force procurement of SAR helicopters: E234.2 million;
19) Army installation of chaff launchers on 20 AH-64A and nine CH-47D helicopters: E5.93 million;
20) Army procurement of one AH-64 flight simulator: E30 million.
Army procurements
There are three upcoming competitions to supply the Hellenic Army with new Armoured Fighting Vehicles (AFVs) and Infantry Fighting Vehicles (IFVs).
The first of these, for 84 wheeled AFVs, is expected to pit the GD Steyr Spezialfahrzeug Pandur II against the Nexter (formerly Giat Industries) VBCI, the new Iveco-Fiat Centauro VBC, the Patria Vehicles Armoured Modular Vehicle (AMV) and the Rosoboronexport BTR-80A.
The second, for 291 tracked IFVs, is likely to involve the BAE Systems Hägglunds CV9030/35, the GD Steyr Ulan and the Rosoboronexport BMP-3F.
And the third, for 50 amphibious AFVs, will involve at least one bid, by Rosoboronexport, with the BMP-3F. The 42 BMP-3s sold to the United Arab Emirates are said to have successfully landed in Sea State 6, although they are only qualified to operate at up to Sea State 3-4.
Navy frigate and ASW aircraft competitions
Though the Greek Defence Ministry says it wants to build six new frigates for the Hellenic Navy, industry observers say that the budget is only likely to cover four.
There are six candidates: Germany’s ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems, in collaboration with its Hellenic Shipyards subsidiary, proposing the new MEKO-D design; the Netherlands’ Royal Schelde yard, with its LCF (de Zeven Provincien-class); Denmark’s Odense Shipyard, offering its new F361 Patrol Frigate design; Spain’s Navantia, proposing the F310 Fridjof Nansen class it is building for Norway; France’s Armaris, proposing a variant of the French Navy’s new FREMM; and Italy’s Orizzonte Sistemi Navale, with a version of the Italian Navy’s FREMM.
There are three contenders to meet the Hellenic Navy requirement for five Anti Submarine Warfare (ASW) aircraft: Italy’s Alenia Aeronautica is offering a version of the ATR 72 ASW aircraft, 10 of which were sold to Turkey last year; Spain’s EADS-CASA is proposing its C-295 transport aircraft equipped with the FITS system; and Brazil’s Embraer is offering a version of its P-99 Maritime Patrol Aircraft (MPA), based on the EMB-314.
Four EMB-314s have now been delivered to the Hellenic Air Force, mounting the Saab Microwave Systems Erieye Airborne Early Warning and Control (AEW&C) system.
AJT and new fighter programs
The competition to supply the Hellenic Air Force (HAF) with 45 new Advanced Jet Trainers (AJTs), to replace its ageing Rockwell T-2C/E Buckeyes, has now moved above the requirement for more new fighters, since the life of the 10 T-2Cs and 35 T-2Es is expected to expire within the next 4-5 years.
There are five contenders in the AJT competition, which MPI understands is likely to be started within the next two years: Aermacchi, offering its M346; Aero Vodochody, proposing the L-159BAT (B from A for Training); BAE Systems, with its new Hawk 128; Boeing, offering an upgraded version of the T-45 Goshawk; and Korea Aerospace Industries / Lockheed Martin, with the T-50 Golden Eagle.
The competition for 30-40 future generation strike fighters is not expected to start until late in the current five-year plan, after completion in late 2009 of deliveries of the 30 Lockheed Martin F-16C/D Block 52+ aircraft ordered in January 2006. A further 10 of these aircraft may be ordered under an option in the contract.
The new strike fighters are required to replace the HAF’s 78 elderly A-7E/H Corsairs and 82 F/RF-4E Phantoms. The candidates are expected to include: the Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet; the Dassault Aviation Rafale; the Eurofighter Typhoon Tranche 2/3; the Saab JAS-39C/D Gripen; and either the latest development of the Lockheed Martin F-16 or, if it meets the HAF requirements and delivery timescale, the F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter (JSF).
Enviado por: Cabeça de Martelo em Maio 13, 2008, 05:04:43 pm
Enviado por: old em Maio 14, 2008, 11:02:21 am
Citação de: "Cabeça de Martelo"
Isso é uma lista enorme, é incrivel a vontade sempre presente de ter melhores Forças Armadas que os Turcos (nem que seja pela qualidade).
En realidad si analizas la lista punto por punto veras que no es para tanto ;)
Enviado por: nelson38899 em Outubro 19, 2008, 10:23:15 pm
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Greece’s Maritime Patrol Aircraft Competition
Greece’s Hellenic Air Force currently operates 4 older P-3B Orion maritime patrol aircraft, which were delivered to the HAF from 1993 – 1996. They are reaching the limits of their airframe life, but options exist. The Orion has upgraded to P-3C designation, and has received a slew of updates since the P-3Bs were fielded. Efforts like Lockheed Martin’s reopening of P-3 wing production are even making it possible for countries like Norway to keep upgraded P-3 aircraft in service.
Greece has reportedly decided not to go this route, and at least EUR 250 million (abut $350 million) has reportedly been set aside for the winner of a 5-aircraft maritime patrol competition. Will the Greeks call on Poseidon once more, in order to protect their seas and mariners?
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Gre ... #more-5118 (http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/Greeces-Maritime-Patrol-Aircraft-Competition-05118/#more-5118)
Enviado por: triton em Outubro 19, 2008, 10:49:51 pm
Enviado por: nelson38899 em Outubro 19, 2008, 10:56:18 pm
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The air force has an urgent requirement for around 70-80 aircraft to begin replacing its McDonnell Douglas F-4 and Vought A-7 Corsair fighters between 2010 and 2012, but speculation that the Greek government could call an early general election in mid-2009 could further delay its plans.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 (http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20) ... deals.html
Enviado por: triton em Outubro 19, 2008, 10:59:50 pm
Citação de: "nelson38899"
utilizão pelo menos até 2012CitarThe air force has an urgent requirement for around 70-80 aircraft to begin replacing its McDonnell Douglas F-4 and Vought A-7 Corsair fighters between 2010 and 2012, but speculation that the Greek government could call an early general election in mid-2009 could further delay its plans.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 (http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20) ... deals.html
Antigos Pilotos da FAP consideraram que o A7 Corsair um avião muito bom. Sei que actualmente se encontra desactualizado, em termos comparativos, quais as diferenças entre um A7 corsair e um F16 block 10?
Enviado por: triton em Outubro 19, 2008, 11:02:09 pm
Enviado por: Lightning em Outubro 19, 2008, 11:20:33 pm
Citação de: "triton"
Antigos Pilotos da FAP consideraram que o A7 Corsair um avião muito bom. Sei que actualmente se encontra desactualizado, em termos comparativos, quais as diferenças entre um A7 corsair e um F16 block 10?
Comparatrivamente o F-16 é um caça de combate aéreo e o A-7 é um avião de ataque ao solo.
Enviado por: Instrutor em Outubro 20, 2008, 12:09:00 am
Enviado por: jmg em Outubro 20, 2008, 06:58:35 pm
É como tudo, gosta-se ou detesta-se.
Mas adoro a linha deste avião.
Enviado por: Lightning em Outubro 20, 2008, 11:50:02 pm
Citação de: "Instrutor"
Sim o Gregos usam o A7, contudo quando compraram aos EUA estes A7 vieram novos, Portugal quando adquiriu os A7 em 1982 estes ja tinham cerca de 16 anos, por isso que durante somente 12 anos cairam muitos devido a idade e o avançado estado de degradação, agora os A7 gregos em 2012 quando estes os quiserem trocar tem 30 anos, muitos velhinhos considerando serem caças bombardeiros onde o desgaste devido ás forças G´s é muito grande, se fossem tipo de transporte pode-se considerar não serem muito velhos mas agora a caças é urgente a sua substituição.
Essas contas estão um bocado mal feitas, os A-7P serviram Portugal de 1981 a 1999, (até havia um A-7P com uma pintura especial com essas datas) o que dá 18 anos.
Enviado por: Firefigther em Outubro 21, 2008, 12:10:43 am
Aqui estão por alto alguns motivos claros e obvios para a Grécia ter um investimento maior nas suas forças armadas que Portugal . . .
Enviado por: André em Outubro 21, 2008, 12:13:29 am
Citação de: "Firefigther"
tb ñ esqueçer da ilha d malta uma parte e pro Grécia ou Turca.
Ilha do Chipre ... :wink:
Enviado por: Firefigther em Outubro 21, 2008, 12:36:53 am
. . . thanks
Enviado por: Engenhocas em Outubro 23, 2008, 12:27:24 am
Enviado por: HSMW em Novembro 08, 2011, 06:13:57 pm
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Enviado por: Smoke Trails em Novembro 10, 2011, 08:15:55 pm
Citação de: "old"
-70 Nuevos cazas: Numero en los que ya estan incluidos los 30 Block 52 Muchos paises Europeos han comprado bastantes mas, Turquia aspira a fabricar el F35..A juntar aos F-16 Blk 30, 50 e 52+, aos F-4 Phantom, alguns dos quais modernizados no programa “Peace Icarus” e aos Mirage 2000EG e 2000-5 Mk.2
Citação de: "old"
-Van a comprar nuevos ECMs para sus cazas. Eso quiere decir que o no los tenian o eran muy antiguos.Ou então vão comprar ECM dos mesmos modelos que equipam o Mirage 2000-5 Mk.2 e o F-16 Blk 52+ para os colocar nas outras variantes destes aviões. Por exemplo, em 1984 a maioria dos F-4 já tinha o sistema de auto-protecção DIAS com quatro antenas, duas das quais eram instaladas nas entradas de ar como se pode ver nas fotos deste tópico.
Citação de: "triton"
Antigos Pilotos da FAP consideraram que o A7 Corsair um avião muito bom. Sei que actualmente se encontra desactualizado, em termos comparativos, quais as diferenças entre um A7 corsair e um F16 block 10?Relativamente ao F-16, o A-7 leva mais armamento a uma distância maior, no entanto, requer mais horas de manutenção por hora de voo, tem uma menor relação peso/potencia (por isso nos anos 80 foi proposto o A-7F que incluía um motor mais potente).
O F-16 é mais manobrável, tem um radar multi-funções, tem mísseis de médio alcance, melhores capacidades ar-ar e ar-terra e opções de armamento mais modernas. Os A-7 já começaram a ser substituídos pelo F-16 Blk 52+.
Porquê um F-16 Blk 10?
Citação de: "Instrutor"
Sim o Gregos usam o A7, contudo quando compraram aos EUA estes A7 vieram novos, Portugal quando adquiriu os A7 em 1982 estes ja tinham cerca de 16 anos, por isso que durante somente 12 anos cairam muitos devido a idade e o avançado estado de degradação, agora os A7 gregos em 2012 quando estes os quiserem trocar tem 30 anos, muitos velhinhos considerando serem caças bombardeiros onde o desgaste devido ás forças G´s é muito grande, se fossem tipo de transporte pode-se considerar não serem muito velhos mas agora a caças é urgente a sua substituição.A Grécia comprou A-7 novos, A-7H, e nos anos 90 comprou A-7E, quando estes foram retirados da marinha dos Estados Unidos, para substituir os F-104.
Cumprimentos
Enviado por: HSMW em Dezembro 10, 2011, 12:57:34 pm
(https://www.forumdefesa.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg641.imageshack.us%2Fimg641%2F7633%2Fwp1112anormal.jpg&hash=bd7feb2b5c70bee930bdc9ab8399e09f)
Enviado por: nelson38899 em Dezembro 10, 2011, 02:31:33 pm
Enviado por: HSMW em Março 04, 2012, 10:33:03 pm
Enviado por: HSMW em Março 09, 2013, 05:39:04 pm
Enviado por: HSMW em Maio 24, 2013, 11:17:15 pm
Enviado por: mafets em Junho 25, 2013, 08:18:02 pm
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Imagens da recuperação de um Mirage 2000BG que fez um pouso de emergência em 9 de junho de 2011. Os pilotos enjectaram em segurança.
Enviado por: HSMW em Março 07, 2014, 05:37:38 pm
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Enviado por: HSMW em Outubro 18, 2014, 12:40:18 pm
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3928/15530226656_9e1e464247_z.jpg)
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(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5598/15369951149_a6c4a86e5c_z.jpg)
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Citar
The Hellenic Air Force (HAF), organized a ceremony for the withdrawal of the A-7 Corsair II aircraft, of 116 Combat Wing at Araxos Air Base, after 39 years of presence in the Greek skies.
:arrow: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/sh ... os/page681 (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?53823-Hellenic-Armed-Forces-Photos/page681)
Enviado por: olisipo em Dezembro 01, 2015, 03:09:19 pm
Greece has approved $125.8 million to spend buying 10 ex-US CH-47D
Greece funds CH-47D buy
http://www.janes.com/article/56328/greece-funds-ch-47d-buy
Enviado por: olisipo em Fevereiro 15, 2016, 08:49:32 pm
Greece to return Orion MPAs to service with MLU
http://www.janes.com/article/58004/greece-to-reurn-orion-mpas-to-service-with-mlu
Enviado por: olisipo em Fevereiro 15, 2016, 10:33:40 pm
Bankrupt Greece shells out €500 miĺlion for military aircraft
http://www.grreporter.info/en/bankrupt_greece_shells_out_%E2%82%AC500_million_military_aircraft/12563
Enviado por: olisipo em Setembro 21, 2016, 10:49:14 am
Dramatic footage of a Greek AH-64D Apache crashing into the Strimonikos Gulf
Fortunately, both crew members escaped safely from the crash, on Sept. 20
This Is the third loss of a D-model out of the 12 initially procured by Greece
Enviado por: nelson38899 em Setembro 21, 2016, 02:11:34 pm
Dramatic footage of a Greek AH-64D Apache crashing into the Strimonikos Gulf
Fortunately, both crew members escaped safely from the crash, on Sept. 20
This Is the third loss of a D-model out of the 12 initially procured by Greece
aqui a culpa foi do piloto!
Enviado por: typhonman em Fevereiro 11, 2017, 11:37:37 pm
A Grécia vai modernizar os seus 160 F-16C para o Block 62 ou V, e adquirir uma esquadra de F-35A...
Por cá, temos uma FA reduzida a mínimos, com a maior parte da frota com médias de idade avançadas ( alouettes, falcons, C-130, Alpha Jets)... Como sempre, quando os F-35 já estiverem a ser utilizados por quase todos os aliados, é que vamos pensar em adquirir uma esquadra para nós...
Vejamos, por exemplo, quando por cá andavamos ainda com F-86, e a transitar para o A-7, já os restantes europeus andavam com F-4, F-5 e alguns já iam para o F-16A...
Agora que temos os modernos F-16MLU, a Dinamarca, Noruega, Holanda e mesmo a Bélgica já pensam no F-35A.. (andamos sempre atrás ). :P
Enviado por: HSMW em Fevereiro 11, 2017, 11:43:32 pm
Mas como é que agora a economia grega já suporta uma aquisição dessas?!
Estimei uma vez o nosso atraso militar em 20 anos.
Actualmente deve ser de 10 - 15 anos em relação a países semelhantes na linha da frente.
Enviado por: typhonman em Fevereiro 12, 2017, 04:08:17 am
Modernizar 160 F-16?! F-35?
Mas como é que agora a economia grega já suporta uma aquisição dessas?!
Estimei uma vez o nosso atraso militar em 20 anos.
Actualmente deve ser de 10 - 15 anos em relação a países semelhantes na linha da frente.
Era o que gostava de compreender !
Mas acho que por lá os Generais ainda se preocupam, tem viva voz e o Tsripas preocupa-se com a Defesa...
Enviado por: Crypter em Fevereiro 12, 2017, 02:54:48 pm
A Turquia e a Grécia já há MUITO tempo que andam pegados, ainda recentemente houve intrusão da FA Turca em espaço aéreo Grego que levou mais uma vez a um scramble de caças Gregos para os interceptar
Citar
http://www.ekathimerini.com/215315/article/ekathimerini/news/turkish-jets-violate-greek-airspace-in-the-aegean
Neste momento, dentro dos países "euro" a Grécia é o único cujas fronteiras correm algum risco.
E depois, há outro pormenor que para mim é o que leva a esta corrida desenfreada de armamento Grego (mesmo não pudendo..) que é o facto de ambos os países serem países Nato! Em caso de guerra não sei como a Nato reagiria.. penso que a Grécia como país tem que pensar que só pode contar com as suas próprias FA..
Enviado por: HSMW em Fevereiro 12, 2017, 03:42:58 pm
Ou a troika já empresta dinheiro para F-35?
Enviado por: typhonman em Fevereiro 12, 2017, 04:13:20 pm
Isso nos sabemos. Agora onde vão busca dinheiro para este investimento é outra questão.
Ou a troika já empresta dinheiro para F-35?
Exato !
Enviado por: Crypter em Fevereiro 12, 2017, 09:53:15 pm
Isso nos sabemos. Agora onde vão busca dinheiro para este investimento é outra questão.
Ou a troika já empresta dinheiro para F-35?
Ora..
Quando souberes, faz favor de partilhar ;) !
Enviado por: HSMW em Agosto 14, 2017, 02:41:17 pm
Greece ready to upgrade its F-16 fleet to the Viper level
https://defencegreece.wordpress.com/2017/08/13/greece-ready-to-upgrade-its-f-16-fleet-to-viper-level/
Até os tesos dos gregos vão atualizar os seus F-16 mais modernos que os nossos para o padrão Viper... :N-icon-Axe:
Enviado por: Vitor Santos em Fevereiro 02, 2018, 12:49:14 pm
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Enviado por: Vitor Santos em Fevereiro 02, 2018, 01:00:46 pm
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Enviado por: Vitor Santos em Fevereiro 02, 2018, 01:07:46 pm
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Enviado por: Charlie Jaguar em Fevereiro 02, 2018, 07:43:36 pm
Enviado por: typhonman em Fevereiro 02, 2018, 11:46:32 pm
Na Grécia não se brinca em serviço.
Aqui brinca-se e muito !
Enviado por: HSMW em Setembro 17, 2018, 09:43:29 pm
Os gregos já vão avançar com a actualização dos seus F-16 Block 70/72 para o V.
Enviado por: Igor em Setembro 17, 2018, 10:40:51 pm
Enviado por: HSMW em Setembro 17, 2018, 10:45:41 pm
Dou uma pista: é um país e começa por T....
Enviado por: NVF em Setembro 18, 2018, 04:50:21 am
Agora alguém que me explique como é que um pais como a Grécia tem 85 aeronaves F16, e por sinal versões muito mais recentes que os nossos, e no entanto já vão iniciar a conversão para a versão viper. O que me leva a perguntar mas que raio de forças armadas é que temos.
Entre 1989 e 2010, os gregos adquiriram 40 F-16C Block 30, 40 F-16C Block 50 e 90 F-16C Block 52. Os Block 30, que entraram ao serviço entre 1989 e 1990, passaram pelo primeiro upgrade profundo (Falcon Up) em 1997.
Fonte: http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article5.html (http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article5.html)
Enviado por: jpthiran em Setembro 18, 2018, 09:18:15 am
ah espera!...estava a sonhar!...
Enviado por: mafets em Setembro 18, 2018, 12:03:31 pm
nós aqui com 40 F-16, modernizados para a versão Viper, mais um bom stock de peças e mísseis também estaríamos descansados...
ah espera!...estava a sonhar!...
Até chegamos a adquirir 45 células... ;) :P
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Portugal adquiriu um total de 45 células de F-16 em dois lotes correspondentes aos programas Peace Atlantis I (20 células Bloco 15 novas) e Peace Atlantis II (25 células Bloco 15 usadas). Do primeiro lote todas serão modernizadas para o padrão MLU, enquanto do segundo, apenas 21 das 25 unidades serão modernizadas, servindo as restantes 4 como fonte de peças. Duas aeronaves foram perdidas em acidentes em 2002 e 2008.
http://www.passarodeferro.com/2012/09/venda-de-f-16-da-forca-aerea-m717.html (http://www.passarodeferro.com/2012/09/venda-de-f-16-da-forca-aerea-m717.html)
(https://www.forumdefesa.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F-mv6OcVG_xHA%2FUO3dwOzAwyI%2FAAAAAAAAINM%2FPQV_DA1bPcA%2Fs640%2F20110323_LPMR-479s.jpg&hash=42c89d3b869e12e995141d1b61ce5b9e)
Cumprimentos
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Novembro 27, 2018, 11:45:05 am
Pilotos gregos distinguem-se em manobras da NATO
Enviado por: HSMW em Novembro 28, 2018, 08:34:31 pm
Pilotos gregos distinguem-se em manobras da NATO
Porquê esta noticia nesta altura? Aprenderam a pilotar agora?
Enviado por: typhonman em Dezembro 29, 2018, 09:57:33 pm
Enviado por: tenente em Maio 30, 2019, 02:12:56 pm
FLIGHTGLOBAL.COM BY: DOMINIC PERRY LONDON
Greece has received its first revived Lockheed Martin P-3B Orion as part of a “rebirth” of the country’s maritime patrol capability as it brings stored aircraft back to service.
Following work performed by Hellenic Aerospace Industries (HAI), the initial aircraft, described as an “interim” step, was presented to Greece’s navy on 17 May.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/xq90/921/MIpRDC.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/plMIpRDCj)
Hellenic Aerospace Industries
Speaking at the event, Geoffrey Pyatt, the US ambassador to the Mediterranean country, said that it was “an honour” to “celebrate the rebirth of the Hellenic Navy’s maritime patrol capability.”
An additional four aircraft are scheduled to be modernised under the effort, which includes a mid-life upgrade to extend the service life of the turboprop type by 15,000h and the installation of new mission equipment.
Greek defence minister Evangelos Apostolakis says receipt of the initial example is “the first step in a major program to modernise these P-3B aircraft”.
Athens purchased six ex-US Navy P-3Bs in 1996, parking them in 2009 amid financial cutbacks.
HAI is carrying out the modifications as part of an overall $142 million contract awarded in February 2016 to Lockheed.
Separately, 70 Bell OH-58D Kiowa Warrior helicopters, :bang: formerly operated by the US Army, arrived in Greece earlier this week.
Athens has acquired the aircraft via the USA’s Excess Defense Articles programme. Initial operational capability with the rotorcraft is anticipated later this year.
http://www.thefifthcolumn.xyz/Forum/viewthread.php?tid=295&page=4
Abraços
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Dezembro 28, 2019, 05:26:23 pm
:arrow: http://www.cavok.com.br/blog/grecia-assina-acordo-para-modernizacao-de-seus-cacas-f-16/?fbclid=IwAR3iv8HRY8tqDznBZbcZe6SqoR8gKKFSEBg29zLe6Drg48Tq3Ybi2yIbAeY
Enviado por: FoxTroop em Dezembro 28, 2019, 07:35:07 pm
https://youtu.be/sOKFYjwcenc (https://youtu.be/sOKFYjwcenc)
Enviado por: goldfinger em Agosto 19, 2020, 04:53:07 pm
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Kampfjet vom Typ F-16 "begutachtet" ein Kriegsschiff (Fregatte "GOKCEADA" F-494) im Mittelmeer
Enviado por: HSMW em Agosto 21, 2020, 12:39:49 pm
Enviado por: typhonman em Agosto 30, 2020, 02:04:06 pm
https://www.cavok.com.br/rafale-para-a-grecia (https://www.cavok.com.br/rafale-para-a-grecia)
Enviado por: tenente em Setembro 12, 2020, 09:20:00 pm
Victor Barreira / Defence 360° (@Defence360) tweetou: The 🇫🇷 @Armees_Gouv has just confirmed the interest of the 🇬🇷 authorities to acquire a fleet of 18 @Dassault_OnAir @ThalesDefence @SAFRAN @byMBDA Rafale fighter jets. The acquisition contract signature is expected to take place in few months.
https://t.co/18hu2VAVQm
https://twitter.com/Defence360/status/1304857035079585796?s=20
Abraços
Enviado por: Major Alvega em Setembro 13, 2020, 12:01:12 am
Oitenta e tal F-16 no padrão Viper com radares AESA mais estes 18 Rafales. Os gregos ficarão com uma componente de caça muito jeitosa.
Enviado por: NVF em Setembro 13, 2020, 03:48:18 am
Enviado por: Lusitan em Janeiro 05, 2021, 12:29:40 pm
Greece okays $1.68 billion defense deal with Israel
The Defense Ministry announced on Tuesday that the Greek government has approved a $1.68 billion agreement to purchase training aircraft from Israel and for an Israeli defense contractor to establish a flight school for Greece’s air force.
The deal, which still must be signed by the two countries’ defense ministries, will see Elbit Systems set up and operate a training school for the Hellenic Air Force. It also includes the sale of 10 Aermacchi M-346 aircraft, known in Israel as the Lavi, and for Elbit to upgrade and maintain Greece’s T-6 training planes.
The Defense Ministry said the agreement, which it called “the largest defense procurement agreement between the two countries to date,” was for 20 years. It didn’t specify when the deal would be inked, but said the Greek government’s decision “enables the parties to move forward in the negotiations” before the signing.
“This agreement reflects the excellent and developing relations we have with Greece. It is a long-term partnership that will serve the interests of both Israel and Greece, create hundreds of jobs in both countries, and promote stability in the Mediterranean,” Defense Minister Benny Gantz was quoted as saying in a statement.
Gantz said he spoke with his Greek counterpart, Nikolaos Panagiotopoulos, by phone after the deal was approved, touting the growing defense ties between Jerusalem and Athens.
During a November visit to Cyprus, Gantz inked a deal with his Cypriot and Greek counterparts to boost military cooperation.
The three countries have forged close ties amid regional tension in the Eastern Mediterranean over offshore gas exploitation rights, and are partners in a project to bring gas from fields in Israeli and potentially other nations’ waters through an undersea pipeline to Europe’s mainland.
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Janeiro 15, 2021, 04:15:55 pm
Enviado por: dc em Janeiro 16, 2021, 10:57:07 am
Enviado por: tenente em Janeiro 18, 2021, 06:39:38 pm
https://www.ekathimerini.com/261342/article/ekathimerini/news/first-upgraded-f-16-completes-successful-test-run
Abraços
Enviado por: mafets em Janeiro 18, 2021, 11:19:15 pm
Cumprimentos :mrgreen:
P. S. Já fui tomar a medicação... :mrgreen:
Enviado por: typhonman em Janeiro 18, 2021, 11:33:51 pm
E 12 rafales é 20 f16v para a FAP não? Se até os gregos ao que parece colocaram os F35 em banho Maria... :mrgreen:
Cumprimentos :mrgreen:
P. S. Já fui tomar a medicação... :mrgreen:
Os gregos andam a pedir de joelhos 24 F-35A aos EUA....
Que FA formidável irão ter, M-2000, F-16V, Rafale, F-35A, só faltava mesmo uns F-15X.
Enviado por: mafets em Janeiro 19, 2021, 12:10:53 am
https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2017/10/18/greece-us-f-16-f-15/]https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2017/10/18/greece-us-f-16-f-15/]https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2017/10/18/greece-us-f-16-f-15/ (https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2017/10/18/greece-us-f-16-f-15/)
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Boeing F-15
In another part of the press conference, Trump mentioned also that Greeks “on their part expressed interest on purchasing more Boeing aircraft.”
Boeing? What Boeing? According to some military news Greek website, Greece has F-15 in mind most likely F-15E Strike Eagle. “Defense Minister Panos Kammenos had a positive approach to such a purchase in the past,” the website adds. Some Greeks puzzled whether Trump meant “Chinook” but he spoke of “aircraft” and not “helicopters.”
Assim como que os F35 competiam com os rafales.
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/greece-could-get-18-rafales-8-for-free-from-france-but-the-f-35-would-be-the-choice-for-the-hellenic-air-force/amp/ (https://theaviationgeekclub.com/greece-could-get-18-rafales-8-for-free-from-france-but-the-f-35-would-be-the-choice-for-the-hellenic-air-force/amp/)
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The French proposal competes with US offer of 20 Lockheed Martin F35, La Tribune reported on 1 Sep.
Cumprimentos ;)
Enviado por: goldfinger em Janeiro 21, 2021, 06:43:01 pm
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El 17 de enero voló el primer F-16 griego modernizado a F-16V Viper (más adelante viajará a USA para certificación). Recordemos que van a modernizar 84 con radar AESA entre otras cosas
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EsMteQlXAAE6EI6?format=jpg&name=large)
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Maiden flight of F16V prototype today! Many thanks to all people involved in this project! USAmbPyatt thank you Sir for all your efforts and contribution! HAF is expecting to receive 84 upgraded F16s in the years to come.
Enviado por: tenente em Janeiro 25, 2021, 06:27:13 pm
Greece signs for Rafale combat aircraft
Greece and France have finalised a deal for 18 Dassault Rafale combat aircraft for the Hellenic Air Force (HAF), valued at an estimated EUR1.92 billion (USD2.35 billion).
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/xq90/923/hicvvx.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pnhicvvxj)
The HAF is to receive 18 Rafale fighters from France, comprising 12 surplus and six new-build airframes under a deal signed on 25 January. (Dassault)
The HAF is to receive 18 Rafale fighters from France, comprising 12 surplus and six new-build airframes under a deal signed on 25 January. (Dassault)
Theodoros Lagios, Director General of Armament and Investments of the Greek Ministry of Defence (MoD), and Éric Trappier, Chairman and CEO of Dassault Aviation, signed the contract in Athens on 25 January, cementing the deal that was approved by the Greek parliament in December 2020. A further contract for logistical support was also signed.
“Greece is a leading European partner, a major member of NATO and a special partner of France, with which Dassault Aviation has stood … by [through earlier combat aircraft sales] for more than 45 years,” Trappier was quoted as saying.
The 18 Rafales will comprise 12 surplus French Air and Space Force aircraft (10 single seaters and two twin seaters) and six new-build aircraft to be built in France. To meet the urgent need of the Greek authorities, the deliveries of aircraft will begin in the summer of 2021 and will be spread over two years. The additional logistic support contract will support the HAF’s Rafale air activity over four-and-a-half years.
As previously reported by Janes, another EUR400 million will be used to purchase MBDA Meteor beyond-visual-range air-to-air missiles (BVRAAMs) and to upgrade missiles already in the HAF inventory, namely Mica air-to-air missiles, Scalp cruise missiles, and Exocet anti-ship missiles, for carriage by the Rafales.
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/news-detail/greece-signs-for-rafale-combat-aircraft
Se a FAP conseguisse o upgrade Viper para os 18 PAI e um investimento, na aviação de caça igual a este da Grécia, já seria muito bom mesmo !!
Abraços
Enviado por: dc em Janeiro 25, 2021, 09:09:40 pm
Enviado por: tenente em Janeiro 25, 2021, 09:17:51 pm
Pelo investimento grego (apenas o custo dos 18 Rafale), a FAP conseguia fazer upgrade a 90 F-16 (os 28 nacionais e outros 62 do AMARG) e ainda sobrava dinheiro. :mrgreen:
e depois encaixotavas 60 F's pois pilotos para eles opatas. :mrgreen:
Era bem melhor fazer o upgrade apenas aos 28 F's ir buscar mais uns quatro V's, comprar armamento á séria para os ditos 32;
Comprar uma dúzia de UH60;
Ir buscar três A400;
Adquirir uma dúzia de M364 para a instrução avançada;
E ainda sobrava dinheiro para modernizar a frota dos 101.
Com esses 1900 milhões já ficavamos com uma FAP muito interessante, bem melhor equipada !
Abraços
Enviado por: dc em Janeiro 25, 2021, 10:49:31 pm
Pelo investimento grego (apenas o custo dos 18 Rafale), a FAP conseguia fazer upgrade a 90 F-16 (os 28 nacionais e outros 62 do AMARG) e ainda sobrava dinheiro. :mrgreen:
e depois encaixotavas 60 F's pois pilotos para eles opatas. :mrgreen:
Era bem melhor fazer o upgrade apenas aos 28 F's ir buscar mais uns quatro V's, comprar armamento á séria para os ditos 32;
Comprar uma dúzia de UH60;
Ir buscar três A400;
Adquirir uma dúzia de M364 para a instrução avançada;
E ainda sobrava dinheiro para modernizar a frota dos 101.
Com esses 1900 milhões já ficavamos com uma FAP muito interessante, bem melhor equipada !
Abraços
Eu usei o número de 90 F-16 apenas como exemplo. :mrgreen:
Tanto avião e enchias Monte Real e ainda tinhas de colocar uns quantos noutra base aérea. 8)
Mas sim, era mesmo nesse sentido, que aquele valor que os gregos vão pagar por apenas 18 aeronaves, 12 das quais em segunda-mão, por cá dava para muita coisa.
Os gregos devem estar a pagar extra pela entrega urgente. :mrgreen:
Enviado por: HSMW em Janeiro 26, 2021, 04:56:45 pm
Sacanas dos gregos...
Mas eles não estavam falidos? Quem é que paga isto tudo?
Enviado por: NVF em Janeiro 26, 2021, 10:18:39 pm
Nós podíamos gastar nos helis evakuativos ou, em finalmente, adquirir uma frota a sério para o combate a FF, por exemplo. Mas parece que só os outros é que precisam de brinquedos, nós contentamo-nos com os habituais discursos de circunstância, cheios de vacuidades, especialmente a seguir a catástrofes como as de Pedrógão Grande.
Enviado por: mafets em Fevereiro 09, 2021, 03:01:05 pm
(https://scontent.flis5-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p180x540/146199875_5841848419158936_2745184241882485419_o.jpg?_nc_cat=105&ccb=2&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=pkDWid_BQkgAX9rDFbY&_nc_ht=scontent.flis5-1.fna&tp=6&oh=ca81d23d637b7a40a23a65026be3a1c8&oe=6048735D)
https://www.facebook.com/passarodeferro.pt/ (https://www.facebook.com/passarodeferro.pt/)
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O primeiro F-16V grego modificado iniciou hoje o voo ferry para os EUA, onde terminará o upgrade e receberá da Lockheed Martin certificação dos trabalhos realizados na Grécia. Foi captado pelo Boris Hermand na escala em Charleroi, Bélgica, de onde seguirá para a travessia do Atlântico juntamente com F-16 da USAF.
Cumprimentos
Enviado por: goldfinger em Maio 23, 2021, 10:21:15 pm
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2Dvo8HXEAMVnqc?format=jpg&name=medium)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2DvsBmXEAEj7_o?format=jpg&name=medium)
Primer Rafale griego
Enviado por: goldfinger em Junho 15, 2021, 06:41:48 pm
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A €1.76B deal for the modernization of the firefighting aircraft fleet of the Greek Civil Protection is about to proceed, including 8 new Canadair CL-515, the upgrade of several existing CL-415 to C-L515 standard as well as the gradual procurement of 11 to 36 Air Tractor AT-802.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E37ZZ9RWUAId6dM?format=jpg&name=large)
Enviado por: P44 em Julho 21, 2021, 06:12:23 pm
(https://i.ibb.co/0KdC11C/FB-IMG-16268873534007072.jpg)
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Julho 23, 2021, 06:15:23 pm
Enviado por: typhonman em Outubro 29, 2021, 10:59:46 pm
Rafale, F-16V, F-35A, Typhoon....
Enviado por: HSMW em Outubro 29, 2021, 11:37:26 pm
Digam-me é, como é que eles fazem para pagar isso tudo?
Enviado por: Major Alvega em Outubro 30, 2021, 01:25:32 am
Já agora comprem também uns F-15 ou uns Su-30...
Digam-me é, como é que eles fazem para pagar isso tudo?
Apesar de terem uma divida muito superior à nossa. Não enterraram dinheiro em novosbancos, tap's, cp's etc. Só aqui dava para comprar 3 ou 4 fragatas de última geração, duas esquadras de F-35, helis de "evacuação", Reabastecedores, LPD's. etc. Ainda sobrava dinheiro. Isto só para falar nos últimos 2 orçamentos.
Enviado por: goldfinger em Dezembro 23, 2021, 06:56:34 am
Ufff penoso aspecto el del avión, en el AMARC los hay mejores
Enviado por: HSMW em Dezembro 23, 2021, 01:37:30 pm
Enviado por: Drecas em Maio 11, 2023, 06:53:57 pm
chegada dos dois primeiros M-346
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Agosto 11, 2023, 09:37:47 am
Enviado por: P44 em Outubro 28, 2023, 05:36:26 pm
Estou a ver coisas ou na imagem 6 são F-4 Phantom?
Enviado por: Cabeça de Martelo em Outubro 28, 2023, 05:50:06 pm
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cy8t7qrMQh7/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Estou a ver coisas ou na imagem 6 são F-4 Phantom?
Eu só vi 4.
Enviado por: P44 em Outubro 28, 2023, 06:23:11 pm
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cy8t7qrMQh7/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Estou a ver coisas ou na imagem 6 são F-4 Phantom?
Eu só vi 4.
4 quê?
Há 10 imagens no post, na 6a imagem que avião é?
Enviado por: Drecas em Outubro 28, 2023, 06:46:57 pm
Enviado por: P44 em Outubro 29, 2023, 09:27:39 am
4 Phantom
Pensava que já não havia no ativo :G-beer2:
Enviado por: Lusitano89 em Dezembro 22, 2023, 04:20:57 pm
Enviado por: Drecas em Janeiro 27, 2024, 12:01:45 pm
https://www.dsca.mil/press-media/major-arms-sales/greece-f-35-joint-strike-fighter-conventional-take-and-landing-ctol